Board of Education · Special Meeting · September 19, 2024

warm welcome to everyone who is joining us this evening the interpreters for tonight are Martha Romo you rilles and Vanessa P Ramirez thank you for taking the time to join us we will now have a moment of silence thank you um colleagues uh we are at the point of our agenda for the agenda review and approval I'd like to acknowledge um that everyone's here miss Umstead is unavailable this evening due to a prior work commitment but is also dedicated to

ensuring that our staff and our Educators have the resources necessary to SU sustain our district and support our students um and we appreciate everybody's presence here and uh wish Miss said the best again we're at the point of our agenda where I will accept a motion to review and approve the agenda I move that we approve the agenda review the agenda second removed by Miss Harold G seconded by Miss Carter uton um to approve the agenda all those in favor say I I I I I all those opposed say no the agenda passes unanimously the next item on our agenda is Operation Services the 2425

compensation schedules Dr Lewis thank you board chair Ro Rogers good good evening everyone to those that are here with us and those that may be watching online uh good evening I do want to start by taking a moment to just acknowledge uh well we have been as a school Community these past uh nine months and acknowledge the the trust that was lost um also want to acknowledge the work that the board has taken to correct this I'll will tell you as a new superintendent coming in um even preparing for the interview in uh this is Day 26 for me still learning and understanding uh where we've been with the goal of not repeating the past you know often say there's a reason that there that your windshield is larger than your rview mirror it's hugely important we understand where we're going but also we must take a moment to look back and see where we've been so we won't repeat um any errors that we've made um in the past uh we want to work to rebuild and maintain that trust I

want to thank all of those that have emailed me and I know our board members have received uh emails as well probably more than I have and um particular I want to call out if if I could just take a moment of personal privilege to call out um speech language pathologist as well as our school psychologist I will tell you as a former EC teacher I know the value that uh first of all all of our employees are to us but particularly during my time as a EC teacher how valuable our psychologists were were and are in addition uh our speech language pathologist as a Al also as a EC teacher the value there but also as a former speech student uh I received speech language therapist therapy from Miss Hill and she worked magic and so acknowledging um the emails that we received from them and uh the errors that we corrected there and I hope you see that this is a way that we will continue to show uh and rebuild that trust certainly understand the importance of uh Fair compensation and the trust that our staff uh and frankly

this community has in US to ensure that we are fiscally responsible and so tonight uh we are pleased to uh present salary schedules that we believe not only correct um some of the past discrepancies but also align us um align um with the commitment that we've been hearing um and the commitment that our staff deserves as it relates to transp transparency and Clarity so these changes are designed to um ensure that our Educators and our staff receive the compens that they so rightfully deserve also um these salaries um are beginning step to set this District up for future Financial stability and with that the work is just beginning um this is not a Finish Line by any means uh this is a first step in a journey to um correct some of the errors in the past but also uh engage with our staff in a way um

that we have never done for and so with that I want to bring to the uh Podium um Rashana price um and I think you may hear from um Dr um AA lassain and maybe occasionally from Dr not Dr yet right sierto all right Rana thank you thank you Dr Lewis good evening everyone Bo members the Durham Community I'm very pleased to be here and it is humbling to be able to hold such precious information and to be able to share it transparently today so we are going to talk about the 2024 2025 salary schedules that have been published and I want to thank everyone that has commented on them we could see the anonymous animals that were in the spreadsheets as people were going through that's what Google does when you someone Anonymous is in there so it's exciting to know that many people were able to see them and I do want to before

I head into the presentation acknowledge that in our 15 days of working through this work that there were some errors that we did need to correct and that is a part of the transparency in seeing many eyes on the work allows for that to happen it wasn't behind a curtain it was forward it was forward and there's vulnerability in that and I think that's a good thing and so on behalf of my organization Eerie success and the team that worked on this I want to thank you for your time and I will walk you through what we've prepared and then answer any questions next slide all right so our agenda tonight I'm going to introduce our organization Erie success a little bit more I want to make sure that everyone understands our approach to developing the salary schedules and then I'm going to talk through key findings as well as recommend Ed next steps and on the

agenda that is there and that was out in in the pry information are all of the schedules they are live you can continue to walk through them click through them e even as you're listening next slide so introduction next slide so Eerie success Eerie success is the organization that I founded about nine years ago we are a minority woman owned business and we are proud of the work that we do we have over 30 years of multi sector experience is so the question around how are we able to respond what was the method that we used we have a diverse background and as I said before we were hired on September 4th so we started hitting the ground running trying to understand what was done previously and how to move forward quickly with transparency and Clarity in addition we have an engineering and operations approach to the work that we do across many functions including human resources and finance which we have been supporting the Durham Public Schools since we were

hired next slide so our approach I wanted to make sure that as we were developing the materials for tonight that everyone would understand what we did and why we did it the first thing that we did was we conducted a YY analysis that is an approach to ask why similar to if you've ever had a toddler a 2-year-old or a three-year-old and they're like why is this guy blue and why does this happen we wanted to ask what happened before and why did it happen and why are we what are the things that we need to know why why why why to get to and determine and uncover the thinking that led to why we were even called and what that was for and then we reviewed the previous work there has been a long history in DPS of uncovering different things and different methodologies and so we wanted to understand what had been done to learn from that and also to build upon it if we could

and in doing so we weren't able to get all of the information that we needed to understand the assumptions that were made and the math behind what was previously done we tried to backwards engineer the approaches that were done to find a pattern to find different schedules and different formulas we weren't able to do that so what we did we we started by drafting schedule to get feedback and this time last week when I was in New York and I was on virtually I was sharing that feedback I was learning from that feedback while also sharing the draft schedules and then from there we created new schedules based on what we learned the new schedules have as you may have seen they have a minut and ax which is what I heard was something that the board said that they wanted it was previous recommendations and also honoring longevity with steps so years of service with steps so we created the schedules that are now out for everyone

to see next slide so our key findings so the first key finding that we found after the YY analysis after backwards engineering trying to understand what had been done is that there's been over customization and inconsistency in previous schedules and pre previous information that we could find there are numerous roles in DPS that are paid off scale or that were adopted based on other decisions that we didn't have access to and we wanted to make sure that everything that we presented that we could stand behind that we could say this is how we got this number this is the math this is the thinking that way if changes are needed we could move forward collectively in addition we wanted to make sure that it was transparent and as I've said before sometimes being transparent can show errors and flaws and we are human and we are working quickly and that will happen and that's

okay because once we know we can make Corrections and move forward and I also think learn from it as as we do together in addition to that the customization has created increased classified salary schedule formulas that aren't necessarily easily duplicated so when you have inconsistencies the ability to duplicate and have Equity across numerous scales like we've seen is really hard to do because the repeated pattern is unknown and what we wanted to do was create a pattern that was consistent we could agree upon here's where we are going to start here's the assumptions that we're making here are the percentages that we have and here are the implications of the changes that we want to make which I think is very important and then we wanted to also Implement schedules that add that have that have less variability over time and less variability with in within them within them one of the things that we heard as we were able to find some

information is there's different percentages between the different steps why is that how did we get there and so we wanted to create some consistency and that's what are in the schedules that are online as well the second key finding is around functional ownership confusion and in working with human resources and finance I I like to to think about it as a two-sided coin and the understanding that on one side of the coin is finance and on the other side of the coin is human resources and we have to be sure that both functions understand that we are working with a quarter size coin or a penny and we have to be in agreement around what that is anytime one function is working off of one coin and the other other side is working off of a differ Siz coin that difference is exponential to not only the schedules that are produced but also the budget

implications and so we want to make sure that that confusion is minimized that Finance can recommend different models of what can what it can look like from a budget standpoint at the same time that human resources is also communicating with what does it mean from a Personnel standpoint both functions must be willing to communicate to the board and to the community what the implications are for recommendations and so we wanted to make sure that in what we produce we can have those conversations and we have been next slide our recommendations as as I've said they are transparent they are out there and they build we've built the salary schedules just for that so that individuals can click on all of the boxes and see the math that there if you enjoy math have at it if you are like I don't want the numbers that's okay we we also put a title slide in there especially on the classified staff that

talks about the methodology so people will understand that we also wanted to make sure that they were viewable so that if there are questions and if there are changes we can make them and they will then be seen real time I was sharing earlier that we are in a day in a time where you order a pizza and you can see the pizza go into the oven and then you can see it come out of the oven and get ready to be delivered and having the veil removed from salaries is important and so that's what we were looking to model we also want to allow this to be a time of education and Clarity around the communication of what someone's salary is and why and how it was built so that we can continue to move forward in a consistent future together so the the schedules that are out there can be modified they can be added to and now we have history to go back to and it's all in one place and I think that's important so that when DPS is looking to move towards the future and as Dr Lewis talked about a future that is financially stable we're all

talking about the same point in time and moving forward collectively next slide so our recommendations are today for the board to adopt the salary schedules so that new employees coming in and current employees are all starting to read from the same sheet of music I'm a band mom so music's important Administration can then begin to provide that transparency and certainty for current employees understanding that comparing what was previously done to what is currently being modeled are apples to oranges comparisons and we don't want to do that we want to have individual conversations and that's the recommendation with employees then next from October to June we need time to be able to systematically work through and Implement a long range plan that that has to happen over time and it can't happen quickly because we

want to be sure that we're all again working from the same methodology and the same assumptions and we want to do that well so our recommendation is start that in October and use this year to be sure employees understand and are clear on where they are now and how can continue to progress in their career with DPS and so the future is around after July July 2025 and Beyond about determining the methodology based on what we learned this year implementing that with policies and procedures from the board and from the salary working group and then ensuring that there's also Community involvement and focus groups there is much Rich history here in DPS and we want to learn from the past and we also want to be sure that we Implement a bright future and then additionally functional support is key for the future as well around finance and Human Resources being able to recommend solutions that they can sustain and that are clear to the board around budget implications as

well so next slide with that I'll say thank you and I will answer any questions that anyone has thank you so much thank you Miss Bryce um colleagues we're going to hold off on our questions I'm going to invite Miss Bry to take her seat so we can move to public comment and hear public comment now that the presentation has been made public comment rules a quick review of the rules first please state your name if speaking for an organization please state your name in the name of the organization second speakers are asked to present their comments in 3 minutes when the yellow light comes on when the yellow light comes on you will have one minute left to start winding up your remarks when the red

light comes on it will be beep which indicates your time is up complaints about name staff students or parents should not be voiced in open session however we are very interested in hearing your concerns with regard to public education safety of students or the operation of the school system finally board members will listen carefully and consider the comments but we do not engage in discussion with speakers our first speaker is Lor Champion followed by Katie KY and then JB Howen hi Lenor Champion lead occupational therapist for Duram Public Schools greetings board members superintendent Lewis I'm tired it's been 11 months since I received my first email regarding my compensation then Saturday uh that was in October of 2023 then Satur Saturday

January 10th the follow-up email stating that errors were made so I know you all know that history but for the last eight months the classified salary schedules have been up in the air I'm tired of trying to maintain Staffing with this uncertainty I'm tired of the stress of vacancies not only occupational therapists but also across EC staff this is harmful to all students and especially our most vulnerable students I'm tired of what feels like the lack of respect for my DPS OT team who are all trained caring and effective supports for our EC students I'm tired of the lack of responses to basic requests and lack of transparency for this entire process please I'm begging you to solve

this issue I know it's complex but it's it's our lives and we're we're just about all used up Katie KY JB Holland followed by Katie MGO and Sydney schil I apologize if I'm pronouncing your names wrong hi my name is Katie KY uh I am a proud member of Dae and I wasn't planning on making a public comment to tonight but I wanted to share with you all what has been on my mind since January and what I've wanted to say to you since January is to be brave you were elected to lead and you have not been leading and it is embarrassing you are bringing in people

outside of our community when you have folks who are willing to do the work for free sitting in this room right now and so I hope you all have a Wonder F night and again please have some courage be brave I yield the rest of my time to JB uh good evening my name is JB Howen I'm the school social worker at kington Middle School up in North Durham um I'm very proud to be a product of Durham Public Schools I attended Forest View Elementary School way back in the day githin middle school and I graduated from Jordan High School in 2009 uh last year I was honored by my colleagues um to be voted as the school social worker of the year so I'm here just speaking on behalf of not only myself but all of my social work

colleagues last spring many of us social workers fought alongside our fellow teachers and classified staff to get this new historic budget passed we were very excited when we heard that DPS would finally offer Master's level pay to all of us who have earned master's degrees uh but I'll be honest we got extremely nervous and pretty upset last week when we found out that um at the board meeting it was stated that only classroom based teachers would receive Master's level pay we School social workers we feel that that is unfair and we want to Advocate strongly to be included in that Master's level pay according to ncdpi Social workers are under the teacher salary schedule and we hope that DPS follows that guideline many of us social workers myself included um have a master's degree which is a totally relevant degree um to do the work we do I personally use the knowledge skills and experience that I got from my Master's Degree every single day of my job with

not just my students but also the families I work with um we social workers we strongly believe that we should be comp compensated for this additional education all of our school social workers are incredibly dedicated and hardworking individuals people who love our jobs and the work we do and we work very hard for our students and families so um just please make sure to include us in the Master's level pay and finally I want to go on record um saying even though I am not a DA Union member um I please urge you to pass me and confer um even as a nonunion DPS EMP employee I just want yall to know there are other people who are not Dae employees who fully trust them to represent us and to advocate for our best interest so please please please pass me and confirm thank you Katie mcgo Sydney schnick I apologize again for

mispronouncing your name followed by Maddie radic me uh once again I came with but I have three minutes September 4th seriously mcell please address the board I am so sorry to the people behind me that had to be hired on September 4th this problem exists in January of last year it was M weekend September 4th can you do your best work in 15 days I don't believe that's true I am so sorry to the people that were hired that now their reputation may suffer we don't vote tonight on this we give them the time the professional time respect and courtesy to do it right because what you launched the other day I don't know how many people looked at it but my

goodness I came here ton night just hold up signs I wasn't going to say a word classified pay no transparency no honesty growing together monaster training in Charlotte from Watson Morehead Primary teachers are case managers Northern High School this one's personal to me because that was my daughter's opening of her first year of high school curriculums curriculums Maps do not align with the million dollars of curriculums that you've spent your money on 30 years of monory excellence and there's still no aligned DPS curriculum map new DSA as a parent I am not heard as a taxpayer I am not heard as a teacher on this piece of paper it says I am unheard but I feel unseen and I feel

unheard last year I joined our Union I was a I was a paying member I had to stop paying for my membership because I chose my children for that 60 something dollars a month but they represent every single one of us so I stand before you and I am not drinking Kool-Aid but when I say that you have to do better you have to do better you have to start listening to us it feels like listen we stand here there's a microphone but nobody hears us there is one lady right there who I'm very excited to meet with her on Saturday um she knows we're hanging out Miss Rogers and I appreciate it um but it is time for you to really invest in us I love that you're doing your little sessions and I'm probably going to get on your nerves because I'll be there at every single one but um we need more from you and meet and confer is the first way to do that thank you

good evening my name is Sydney schi neck and thank you for your Valiant efforts pronouncing that last name um I am the social worker at Parkwood Elementary this is my second year working for DPS I found my way to school social work through my first job out of undergrad as a bilingual family president reservation case manager in Baltimore I worked closely with school social workers and admired their powerful positionality as Community connectors Advocates and compassionate safe adults to their students and families while in mssw is not required to be a school social worker in North Carolina my undergraduate degree was a double major in Biochemistry and Spanish so in order to get into this role I did have to get a relevant master's degree I came to North Carolina for grad school at uncc's School of Social Work where I graduated in May of 2023 I was excited to then receive job offers from both wake and Durham public schools in spite of the Master's pay offered in Wake County I chose to accept the position with DPS because a core practice belief of mine is that social workers are more

effective the more familiar we are with the community we're serving I dove into my first year of practice serving two schools with a total of about 1,200 enrolled students almost five times the nasw that's the National Association of Social Workers recommended ratio of one school social worker to every 250 students I joined the durm association of Educators and was proud to see us win majority membership last year even proud to see the historic budget you all passed and relieved to hear that our fight had won US Master's pay when the Master's pay survey came out and the language was specific to classroom teachers social work friends expressed concern but I didn't believe that we would be left out until I received the news last week I'm here tonight because I am so disappointed in Durham Public Schools right now the way our voices and our Union have been excluded from budget conversations in the absence of meet and confer has impacted not just me and my colleagues but the families that we serve to be the person in the building who holds space for a mother who has lost her job because student

transportation that she signed up for in May is still not available putting her housing at risk when our shelter system is diverting families to other regions because weight lists are taking months to move through do you know how hard we work to support DPS families and also prevent our own burnout in this job tonight I had to reframe my selfcare as coming here to spend my time with you and advocate for myself I need your respect I need our Union voices at the table where these decisions are being made I need and deserve for my self-care to be to go home and rest at the end of the day I hope yall do the right thing and compensate me and my colleagues appropriately for for our training thank you Maggie radic Kimberly WS P recton wall I'm Maggie Ric 7year science

teacher at Northern High School da member um every single misstep that y'all keep making excluding uh Masters pay for school psychologists and social workers the Panic yesterday about potential pay cuts for slps um and sorry for slps and school psychologists that the Panic yesterday about those pay cuts as well as the continued frustration and confusion um about classified pay just really underscores that y'all should have passed me in confer months ago we would have been working this summer to work on the salary schedules to make folks understand what was going on and feel feel valued and compensated um and you just should have done it months ago and I really we really need you to do it next week and I see the rest of my time

toly board members and superintendent thank you for this opportunity to be heard um I'm Kimberly wins I am a speech language pathologist I started off the year at the wonderful beautiful Murray massenberg Elementary School school and then was called to also help over at Lowe's Grove I'm very honored to be a part of both of those communities um and I appreciate y'all listening as we want to build a speech pathologist communication confidence in our students and our community for advocacy and support and I seed my time to Tiny rore hi good evening board members and Dr Lewis my name is Tanya rectenwald I'm a speech language pathologist who has worked for dur public schools for 26 years as you can tell by my worn out badge um and I'm in my 29th year as a public school speech language pathologist I always wanted to work for

schools and so that's all I've ever done as be a speech pathologist for students in the public schools I'm also the assist of Technology team lead the assist of technology team serves students with complex needs from prek through high school and DPS and consists of slps OT and a PT first of all I want to thank you for all for acknowledging the mistake on the salary schedule that was posted yesterday and updating the new schedule of local supplements we are certified staff and have a DPI license a state license and a national certificate of clinical competence that we have to work with very hard in long hours and and take tests to achieve I do have a concern that the new salary schedule that was posted that the supplement supplement amounts are staying the same as last year that were to copied and pasted where in previous years it's been my understanding of

being here for a very long time that it's a percentage of the base pay that we get from the state so that means that when our base pay from the state is increased that the supplement should be at least slightly increased based on the percentage that it should be taken from that base pay and added to our salary so that did not change from last year to this year so I wanted to point that out um also um DPS is is recently um spoken about has reinstated um Master's pay for teachers which is wonderful I'm completely for that however base pay for Sops audiologists and psychologists is a master's degree we cannot work without a master's degree we have to have that level of Education to start many of us have an Advan lure based on extra hours of school I do get paid at that rate

because I've been here so long and I was grandfathered in many of my younger colleagues who have started after the state changed the law are not being paid at that level of the ADV Advanced ler um so they you know have that in their field to work as a speech pathologist so that is a step Beyond The Master's pay and then there's a doctoral level for speech pathologists as well so I wanted to point that out because I felt like you probably all weren't aware of that either for our field I'm also here to support the classified staff whose salaries have been upended since last year salary study still does not appear that the pro salaries are where they should be based on the expectation that no one would make less than they did in the 2023 school year and then last year when all this happened and that they would actually get raises I actually lost a team member who was a PT when this happened she had many many many many

years of experience that were taken away from her in a day and felt disrespected when that happened and and quit and left in three days and I was out a staff member and while I have your attention um you may not be aware that myself and other leads in our departments in the related Services field is what we call ourselves like um Lenor our lead OT our lead PT lead um for Audiology adapted PE teachers of visually impaired we all our lead speech pathologist we all oversee our departments in the EC for all the schools that those staff members serve we do not get any further compensation for doing that job I work on a speech pathologist salary schedule the same as another speech pathologist that has the same years of of experience but is not doing the job I'm

doing supervising a team of employees I don't think when those of us who have been around a long time retire you're going to get people to fill those positions we already have a vac vacancies that have not been filled or have taken a year to be filled because who's going to do that take on a job that you're supervising going to meetings with attorneys and making sure everything is in place and all your procedures are um taken care of without getting pay for that resp extra responsib ability so I just wanted to bring that up to the board as well all of the staff that um I just mentioned whether certified or classified we ensure that students with disabilities IEPs are implemented as Mand mandated by federal law if we do not have that staff which we are short staff in all of these departments it becomes difficult to meet those

requirements we are all asking for budget transparency and recognizing Durham's Association of Educators through a strong meet and confer policy thank you for your time Mary John McClair Moss Sato Paige Akim good evening I'm Mary Joan McClure a veteran speech pathologist with 24 years experience uh DPS employee as an SLP uh DPS parent and I signed up for the purpose of seeding my time to masato good evening members of the school board superintendent Lewis my name is m Sato I'm a speech therapist at Forestview Elementary first I want to acknowledge that I success has restored the salary supplement for speech

therapists psychologists audiologists and this correction ensures we can continue providing critical services to our students however I urge board members to scrutinize the draft for mistakes increases that are barely above inflation and wage compression as employees move up in steps it is essential for the district to handle compensation decisions accurately and transparently and and allow time for adequate review compensation reflects the district commitment to staff not just Financial Security missteps regarding pay can erode Trust and Goodwill and getting these decis decisions right the first time is crucial for maintaining morale engagement and talent retention please don't repeat the same mistake I also urge the district to adopt a meet and confer policy having a formal process in place ensures transparency and allows for constructive dialogue which can prevent misunderstandings and help align the district's goals with the needs of its staff additionally I want to address the compensation of speech therapy contract

employees contractors are vital in supporting DPS staff and filling vacancies yet the current hourly wage is not competitive this is led to losing qualified professionals to other districts and agencies to attract and retain top talent we must offer competitive compensation for all who contribute to Student Success lastly I urge the board to proactively prepare for the growth of Durham's school age population as the city expands so will the need so will the needs of services especially in specialized areas like speech therapy we must be ready for this influx to avoid last minute gaps addressing this now will help help us remain competitive and continue meeting the needs of our exceptional children High turnover and disruptions to Services can also result in non-compliances compliance with IEPs as required by the individuals with disabilities Education Act failure to meet these obligations could put the district at risk of legal challenges and violations of federal federally mandated services

competitive wages strong contractor support and proactive planning are critical to the success of our schools and the well-being of our students thank you for your time thank you P Ken Melissa IMR Kristen Hovis hi I'm P jaken I am a SLP serving Lakewood Little River and I'm coaching our first year slps um being a coach has given me the vantage point to see how absolutely outstanding our speech Department here is at Durham uh I would confidently say we have the best speech Department in the state um I don't think you're aware what it is to be a speech therapist in Durham it means in some of our schools we don't have any space right we don't get an office sometimes we're working out of Cl closets we don't

get a budget for materials from the schools or from the district year after year okay these highly skilled Master's trained clinicians this year or this week had a heart attack when they heard that they might be getting these pay cuts um I would like you to know in our department we do peer review it's kind of a pain it is but we do review each other's work weekly before we send it out just second well we should um um I just would like the board to consider the impact it has when you rush things and the impact it had on our department and our morale as we do not have a fully staff department I the rest of my time to Melissa

imer hi uh my name is Melissa imer I am an AC prek teacher here at DPS I love my job I love my students I love my families and I'm proud to be here I'm also a proud Dae member and I urge you to pass a strong meet and confer policy um and I'm here to support my wonderful SLP that I could not imagine going through my job without and I seed my rest of my time to Kristen Hovis good evening my name is Kristen Hovis and I'm a DPS speech language pathologist um I'm also a DPS parent and a proud member of Dae um I work at the witted School for those of you who may not have heard of us we're a DPS school that educates the um only preschool students some of our youngest Learners in DPS for those of you who might think speech language Pathologists spend their days teaching students just how to

practice sounds that's only a small portion of our jobs most of our students have language disabilities as why as well as a range of complex needs speech language Pathologists provide mandated services to almost all students who have IEPs in in our buildings we conduct assessments serve as EC case managers consult and complete an extensive amount of paperwork that's often completed after our own uh children have gone to bed at night we also complete Medicaid logs within 45 sorry 24 hours of the services we provide so the district can receive reimbursement for our services I felt compelled to speak regarding the newly released salary schedules I feel lucky a colleague contacted me after school yesterday to fored me they had been released um as otherwise I wouldn't have known about them through my work email until almost noon today in the middle of my workday and just hours before this meeting as I first looked at the new Speech Pathology salary schedule I panicked noting an $8,000 decrease

from my current salary I began to realize the local supplement currently part of our salary had not been included and there was no way for us to know if this was an error or as intended as colleagues began communicating over the course of last night there was confusion worry and disappointment at the same time a teaching colleague was in disbelief at her significant pay raise which by the way she would absolutely deserve had it been correct after many emails to the board last night we could see this morning that some pay SCH schedules have been adjusted either up or down in the case of the speech pathologists audiologists and school psychologists the supplement was added back into our Pace scale making it seem as though it's previous Omission had been an error we would like reassurance and explanation of the new salary schedules and including how the supplement was calculated with such a quick turnaround between new Consultants being tasked with creating the new salary schedules and only a day between their release and

presentation to the board tonight for a vote I'm concerned what other errors or omissions might be present in the salary schedules for other positions with notice of the new schedules being released only hours ago many people have not even checked them let alone had enough time to analyze the changes they're seeing at the last Board of Education meeting you're committed to getting the process right and with the events of the last 24 hours it's could be difficult to trust that that is happening what my colleagues and I experienced last night seems very similar to the confusion panic and disappointment felt by classified Staff last January over Martin Luther King Jr weekend when they received an email explaining that their pay increases were being taken away in their case however there was no error that was adjusted overnight eight months later their new salaries are finally being presented in an official capacity and many classified staff are asking us where their significant pay raise is Dae provided much of the crucial energy and efforts necessary to secure the $27 million

provided to DPS from the County Commissioners in June with the majority of those funds earmarked for staff salary increases including over $8 million doar dedicated to classified pay raises we would like transparency regarding how that money is being spent and whether the funding is being used to pay for pay raises as promised for both classified and certified staff given the events of last year transparency is crucial for rebuilding trust with DPS staff across the district that's difficult to achieve without sharing how those funds contribute to the new salary schedules in addition having the board approve a meet and confer policy with Dae is essential to rebuilding trust and to help prevent the types of mistakes and miscommunications that seem to repeatedly occur with the majority of DPS workers being Dee members we are the only organization that can quickly get input from all workers in our building and share that with the board when significant decisions are being made with workers having a formal seat at the

table you would have much more information regarding what is occurring across the district given the organization of Dae throughout the district we are capable of quickly sharing information from you leading to better communication more trust and a feeling that our voices and our work are being respected given the fact that many of us could earn higher salaries in other districts and work settings but choose to be here because we're dedicated to DPS students regaining our trust is essential to us staying in the district as part of a department that often has vacancies and requires contracted positions to fill gaps in Staffing that still remain unfilled the district cannot afford for for more of us to seek employment elsewhere if we are not here to provide mandated IEP Services the district is left out of compliance and vulnerable to litigation correct salary schedules budget transparency and adopting a meet and confer policy are steps you can take to try to retain staff so that we can do what we love serving the students of DPS thank you

Samantha canopy I'm sorry I can't read your handwriting followed by Bethany pergerson and Kelly Becker hi I'm Sam Kip and um I'm a speech language pathologist at Murray massenberg I also serve preschool assessment team and at RN Harris um and I am planning to seed my time but I do want to say that yesterday um afternoon when we got notice of these salary schedule changes um I was really upset I have two small children we depend on my income to help for child care and my husband said to me don't worry Sam like they can't just cut your pay and I was like oh they can't um and I think that had the events of the last year not happened then I would have probably believed him but there's just been so much loss of Faith

with the with the public with this that um I just feel like this really underscores the need for a meet and confer um I think that I just don't I I there's nothing personal but I just don't trust that we can that we can trust you so and I see the rest of my time to Bethany hi I'm Bethany pergerson um thank you for having this time for us to speak tonight um I'm a speech therapist on the preschool assessment team um in Duram Public Schools I've been here for 20 years um we on this uh preschool assessment team are some of the first people that um with DPS that are these families coming in encounter and we really work hard to provide a loving and

nurturing experience and a landing place for people coming in who are scared and worried about their children and want them to get some special education supports um I'm speaking out with my co-workers tonight to advocate for full budget transparency and a meet and confer policy to give our majority Union a seat at the table for decision making North Carolina I don't know if you know this we're one of three states that affords public school workers no formal voice in our working conditions no seat at the table and that brings us to why we're here tonight many of us spent last night sending panicked emails and texts to our co-workers wondering why the new pay scales included no County supplements for slps school psychologists and audiologists what we were seeing reflected a pay decrease of $4,000 to $10,000 per year

m. working on her resume none of us got much sleep last night and then we come today and our working conditions are our students learning conditions how are we to provide support for our students and that love and care for our students when we're worried about our own livelihoods this was sickeningly reminiscent of that Tuesday in January when we learned just how little our County thought of our classified co-workers while we hoped it was a mistake we know that the wrongs leveled on our classified staff still have not been made right nine months later now we have these corrected salary schedules but there are significant concerns you know speech therapists who are not you you know experts in budget who are doing but who are doing their best looking over these schedules saying well I see this here and this here

trying to make heads or Tales of it why why are we doing this like why we're supposed to be serving kids loving on these kids giving them their federally mandated individual education programs and their um free and appropriate public educations but we're worrying about our livelihoods and we're sitting here analyzing salary schedules instead and we again that just that trust is is down to zero um we can't do our jobs in this environment it's really tough um I will also I have a little more time so I'll speak on you know we're in a staffing shortage as well this this does not help um a number of us speech therapists in the county have been asked to cover vacant positions now most people if they have more than one job they get more than one paycheck but we are asked to do this with no compensation while that money sits it's sitting there but we don't get

it we're just it's piled on us the work is piled and piled and piled on us I have a full-time job with the preschool assessment team that's the job that I love to do and I'm passionate about that I drive from Southeast Raleigh to do every single day for the past 11 years I can find something else easily but I want to do my one job that I've been hired to do not a job and a half or a job in a tenth or a job in a 20th I want to do my one job and it's it's really demoralizing and stressful to have to pick up that extra because we can't keep people because this county is very difficult to work in I'd also like to advocate for Master's pay for all teachers I'm working on the preschool assessment team with teachers who are Master's levels teachers but because they don't have a classroom or or whatever other excuse

they are not getting their Master's pay and it's it's there's demoralization across the board and we need some respect and we need what's right thank you L [Music] Becker Beth Clifford Jenny Bailey good evening my name is Kelly Becker I'm a speech language pathologist at Little River School want to thank the board Dr Lewis for listening to the concerns of my colleagues tonight they're the concerns of everyone sitting in the back here they were saying things we're all thinking I'm seing my time to

Beth good evening everyone my name is Beth Clifford I'm a sixth grade teacher at githens middle school and I'm a Dae member proud da member and I'm here in solidarity tonight with my colleagues last week at the board meeting I was sitting here and um there was a lot of emphasis on getting it right so I have some comments nothing will be right nothing we be right under a system that promotes outright deceit disrespect and hierarchial disregard for all of us nothing the only product of that system is incompetence distrust and deep disillusionment which we all know hurts our kids the most as many of you said last week this is about our kids we all feel that way and we need systemic change and we cannot wait for it any longer we have to get this right getting it right would be inviting workers to the table whenever you deliberate on their compensation and

their conditions that would be right we could have avoided so many Panic moments including like the one last night that all these people had to suffer through if there was a regular practice of inviting us to the table getting it right would be transparency transparently sharing all budget information including the constraints especially openly so that we can come to Funding Solutions together as a community because this is public funds getting it right would be centering the expertise of the people on the ground who know our schools best whenever you have to make a tough decision which I know there are many about where we need to cut you have to listen to the people on the ground and finally getting it right would be checking any proposed numbers yourself as a publicly elected School Board member before they're public right opposed to blindly trusting Administration who have repeatedly made ma major mathematical errors just in the last six months you have to check the numbers yourself because we can do that

too getting it right has never ever ever looked like hiring not one not two but now our third private contractor three and fully trusting each of them to solve a pay issue that affects all of us our community I can't believe that this is the reality you all are making us live in again and genuinely no disrespect at all to you Miss price you seem lovely but last week we were sitting here and a stranger Zoomed In from New York and we were told that this stranger is responsible for determining our pay on a 15-day timeline and this is because the private contractor that that you hired last spring who you also blind trusted to make these pay scale scales apparently produce numbers that were majorly off in a way that was not okay so it's like you're sending all of us the message that the only way we can have expertise and respect and credibility in this district is to work for a for-profit Enterprise that's the message that I'm

getting as a DPS teacher I have never had any interest in making money I don't think any of us do because we care about the kids we care about our community we care about Durham this is what we do we care for a living and really that's all we've ever asked of you all to help us live and Care especially when it feels like many in this current political climate of Rapid privatization in school shootings would rather see us die we need you to help us live and also have some rest that would be nice and the only way to do to help us do that and get it right as you say is to listen to what we've been saying for months now recognize our Union respect the fact that we are the ones showing up every single day for these kids and for each other and therefore we know what is best for our schools in our community and begin negotiations through meeting confer with us

5 half now need an explanation for that number two um many positions that used to have one grade level recommended now have a range of grades that's recommended why and what will the guidelines be to place individual

employees within this range of grades it sounds like there's some room for some more over customization and without the guidelines ready right now tonight people do have no idea what their future pay will look like and if they'll ever get a raise for the rest of their career because that's what the 05% differential does and then lastly in the SLP um audiologist psychologist and counselor schedules there are some major discrepancy in the figures I sent you spreadsheets through your email and then probably the number one question I've been hearing my building this month is what were y'all doing this summer because we would have gladly worked unpaid at the table with you all to figure this out we need get it right Jenny Bailey Ellie Harbaugh Christy clim and Lauren tin hi my name is Jenny Bailey and I'm going to seed my time to Ellie hi I'm Ellie Harbaugh I'm a

multilingual speech language pathologist working on the assist of Technology team that supports all the schools across across the district I wasn't going to speak here originally but I do feel like I want to say a little because I really do care I care deeply for this community which is why I even work currently to serve the Durham Public Schools families the spanishs speaking communities the english- speaking communities everyone speaking other languages and I am here because I'm here to represent the many confused and frustrated EC staff and speech language Pathologists and related services including the classified staff on all of these um discrepancies and the lack of transparency overall with this budget we really do need Fair compensation for all of our staff to maintain staff here within DPS to hire more staff to fill the vacancies that are open right now and we especially

need a proactive approach rather than being reactive as we're seeing is is continually happening to add address these concerns so I urge you to pass the meet and confer policy today and I seed the rest of my time to chrisam good evening Christy clim physical therapist um I'm pretending I wrote something out but I didn't um I do appreciate the time um I've been able to speak some to some of you individually and I've gotten some responses in email they're pretty generic email responses that we'll try to get back to you but I am not under a false pretense that that is anything like me and confer I like to have a better understanding and I want to try to educate my colleagues and co-workers and I want information so when I go back and share it in the eight buildings and preschool assessment team that I'm on that I'm sharing factual information it is so hard for us to get facts right now and I wonder is it because the facts

aren't there are things being withheld from board members to us or is the Bo not getting the facts they need to make good decisions from admin it was presented last well there were lots of things last year that were frustrating but um it was presented I've been in all the meetings but one I if I wouldn't have been out of state I would have been here and my I need to apologize to my spouse because I'm here all the time and she actually said last night I'm ready for you to be home physically with the time I spent here but emotionally with the time that I'm checked out because even even if I am at home I'm on the computer I'm looking at a spreadsheet I'm calling speech therapist I'm saying let's go through this and when they're reaching out yesterday in 24 hours of what does this mean well this is what I was told in January discreetly once we ask lots of questions if you're going to be held at this pay here you might not get another race for 20 years that's what we

were told in January when we asked is that what the new schedules mean now because when I look at my pay looks like I could be frozen for four more years before I'm even going to be eligible for something else now that's better than back in January when people lost 30 years but there's not there's transparency in the sense that they're posted I appreciate that even if it is short but there's not transparency in what it really means with men's and Maxes and multiple grades and how people fall and I'm very fearful that we're going to continue to get um nuanced answers with semantics that appear one way when in fact that's not what it is so it was presented 11% um the flat raise that was given last year that was in the recurring budget no matter what else happens we can go for it with 11% more conversations I have it doesn't seem like that's the case if we don't if 11% wasn't in the recurring budget would we be in a bigger Financial deficit if the county wouldn't have agreed to give almost

8 and if it's not there say it and last week there was conversation about oh people want steps we're going to give you steps and the nuanced at the end of Step doesn't mean you're actually going to go up financially that'll be up to the board is it a public facing step that we're moving on or are we just pretending to say that so hopefully employees calm down a little bit and don't come back and say what does this really mean Masters pay that's there's not Clarity in how that's being done EC

supplement has anybody talked to the people in EC not just those of us that provide the services but has anybody talked to our immediate supervisors or the one before that the criteria of case managers get ECS supplement is not being appli I mean that's it's not even how it's presented if you look at who is or isn't a case manager how do y'all find Define that and how is that really defined in EC is it IEP case manager is it people who have a case load of students some of the people that y'all have listed on the this is a classified employee getting an EC supplement isn't even a classified staff bi teachers are certified dhh teachers are certified but yet they're called on the classified side like there's so many glaring red flags that are not accurate why would we trust a big picture Master's Pay Teachers need Master's pay I'm a I'm a former teacher my national board certified teacher I would be getting it there I went and got

my doctorate because I have to have a doctorate to do pt OT and PTs here are paid like they have a bachelor's if I was paid like a a speech therapist or a psychologist or an audiologist in my nine years here I would have made $100,000 more dollars I've done the math some years at 16,000 less than I make for my colleagues that have the same level of lure and education we serve the exact same students there's not even Master's recognition For What and now it's it's required OTS have to have a MERS they also have the option to have a doctorate otpt is not being included in the EC supplement we're not being recognized for Master's Advanced pay or doctorate level pay I'm so glad speech and psych and ideologists and counselors and those folks on the certified side it got fixed in 24 hours you know what classified people were saying in the building today we've been sending emails for nine

months did it only get fixed because they're a certified staff member was the plan really to try to offset the big hole financially the district has been in so maybe we could slip in those true pay SC were those pay scales yesterday true were we going to do that to try to make up some of these pots of money that things have been taken out of now when what what I heard what I was asked certified in those positions had 24 hours to send emails and make calls and get upset District doesn't want an upset certified they're they got their supplement back classified has been doing it for nine months and has gotten nothing the pay scales that came out that I've briefly looked at in the last 24 hours and I wish I could continue to expand my my spreadsheet right now it's got heel 11% comp troller comp trollers next one um this last one that just came out it's all colorcoded I'm not a math person but I can YouTube and learn how to do Google Sheets the step 30 for the ones I've

looked at match up with the year 2021 so we're now going to pay our most advanced people going forward what people were getting paid in 2021 why is anybody going to stay I have 30 seconds I'm sure I will come up with something else anybody yeah I started with me confer I'll go back to it one-on-one conversations don't make it happen I appreciate the empathy and the head nods and the thank you and that some people very genuine I hear you and I apologize and I'm sorry that is not the same as meet and confer I can continue to wear myself out and and nothing will change I end every day with I'm hopeful

thank you Miss Clen thank you Lauren s hi my name is laurren stin I'm a DPS parent of two children with identified disabilities including my second grader who's been working with his amazing SLP since kindergarten so thank you after the classified staff crisis there's one thing that the board should have nailed down before the school year started and that's employee pay policy instead here we are in late September there are no salary schedules and year round schools started back in July what do we have the board is Contracting with its third consultant um I'm not sure how the work is different from the other Consultants work but these are public dollars paying for these contracts meaning that but those are resources that could be going into

schools you don't need more focused groups your employees have been here every other Thursday and they are here in this room telling you again what they need is they need to know what they will be paid and then for you to pay them what you promise over the last year we've learned that central office HR infrastructure is lacking payroll Systems and Technology are outdated staff are working Beyond capacity there's so much room for error and many HR mistakes continue to be made like the many certified teachers Whose license renewals weren't processed just a few weeks ago and they were sent to emails telling them they'd be paid as substitute teachers these mistakes have serious implications for people real people the people who educate our kids every District in the country has salary schedules doing this work didn't have to be so hard and it shouldn't have taken so long why didn't we just start by looking to our neighbors we could have started with Wake County salary schedules J for County salary

schedules and go from there maybe it's not bold enough maybe it's not unprecedented enough but it could have gotten the job done as a researcher I ask questions what about what makes a school a good place to work what do we find over and over again teachers and staff want to work for leaders who they trust superintendent Lewis already talked about the importance of trust tonight but how can you have trust when your livelihood is constantly in question thank you that concludes sorry y'all public comment um colleagues Dr Lewis we have an opportunity now for questions comments um for Miss price and the salary

schedule where would you like to start I was curious to know if before we get started with our questions for Miss price if Dr Lewis wanted to say a few words broadly and not directly in response to public comment but broadly in response to public comment speaking broadly but not in response to um to public first of all thank you um I shared that there's a reason that um board agenda items are released days before the agenda so more eyes are on the agenda there is a reason that public comment uh is a part of um the the board meeting

and I will tell you it's not just a checkbox um and I appreciate board chair Rogers giving that opportunity before the board engaging questions to hear from from you all um again as I continue to come in and um learn uh North Carolina School Finance to learn the organization to identify uh pain points with in the organization to develop um plans to address some of those pain points but also move with a sense of urgency as I mentioned considering what you all have been through I wasn't here so I can't sit here and say I understand because I don't I was not here but still wanting to move with a sense of urgency um in a calculated way that ensures that we don't repeat where where we've been and I will tell you that um there's there's competing values as it relates to making sure that this this is

right if we wait too long there's there's other uh implications that will impact our employees from a retirement standpoint so want to want to address those as well and so I'm definitely interested in um hearing board's feedback uh hearing Direction uh I again I appreciate everyone that has um provided public comment tonight but also those that have submitted questions that have caused us and definitely caus me again as I continue to learn um and ask and ask additional questions um of of staff and so with that I um I always say hope is not a strategy but I am hopeful that this is um part of the growing pain and I like I said I want to honor and respect the pain prior to me even getting here you know that you all have been through but please know that I'm coming in with an objective lens but also from a standpoint of um as I was said earlier getting it right I really

do want to get it right but but but and as I mentioned this is just uh the beginning as a term in terms of additional work there will be uh opportunities for staff to come in and uh continue to provide us feedback in a more um organized and and systemic way that will serve as um a way for us to ensure that years from now that voices are at the table um often say that leadership is not a position everyone can lead uh from from their seat and it's important to have other leaders at that table well thank you for that opportunity Miss SP so I want to start this evening with with deep appreciation for you Dr Lewis being willing to um lead forward through um one of the most complex issues in

this community and on this board um ever and I want to start with appreciation for Miss oo and Miss price for and Dr L for the tireless work that you all have put in to to moving this forward and um trying to carry the threads of of Prior decisions and values of this board in our community to shape and shift um what we can pay um and so none of my questions go to um any debates of the strength of of y'all's talents and your work and your commitment um I do appreciate so much every person that has spoken tonight um your your criticisms are heard um they're valued they and I also wonder who's not here um because we're not

hearing from our custodians and our cafeteria workers and um so many other job classifications that that are not here with us tonight um and these came out recently so I do want to at least start with the question of if there's any flexibility or time to get more feedback from our community before we move forward on on these um these schedules in these scales and and that is also a question that goes to my wanting to have clarity as as we what I have been telling folks is the the individual email that you received you will be paid at either the higher of that plus the 3% or inclusive of the 3% and the other or the other

schedule that just came out and I don't know if I'm giving out good information or bad information and so this is and I see heads rolling and eyes rolling and I get it um so I guess my first question is really the the notion of whether this board and um has time to hear from more folks um as we move forward ales that's a question for us is it's a deadline actually for for whether people's retirement is impacted by the timing of this vote whether the Masters and the EC supplements since it's local money have to be decided tonight it it's a question that that I think should frame kind of whether we whether we have time or not and whether our community has

time Dr leis go ahead thank you ward member berer that's exactly what I was speaking to earlier as it relates to those competing values and um the system I think is called orbit um again I'm learning so it's it's like an impact now or an impact later as it relates to to retirement and I know Dr Giovani and Sierra are intricately involved in maybe Rus as well on on the orbit in terms so I'll try to explain it as as I have learned it we have uh up to 90 days is is what the language says um to do any type of retro activity retro payment that will not impact your retirement if we go past those 90 days then it will begin to impact your retirement um Sierra Dr giovan's 90 days from what date 90 days from the um July one basically is that

date yes um the language that was Shar with us from the state orbits is that it is the month of the report Plus 90 days and so we will report retirement on October 5th so that's the month of the report and then 90 days back from that is the July one and miss o Jo did share that there are people that get paid before ju um July 30th even so we start we have miscellaneous pays that occur starting like the first week or so of July so um based on um that language that we read in the state retirement report as well as the conversation with Miss Vicky goof who has been the payroll supervisor for many many years um here in Durham she indicated in the past that they had attempted to submit them afterwards and it failed um with orbit to be counted towards the retirement So based on that to be safe um she was her strong recommendation in her belief and our interpretation of that language that

in order for the payments for July to count towards retirement they would have to be made in September and then submitted in October 5th report can you address um I think there was a previous year or maybe two years ago um where retr payment was made after the October date can you talk about how that happen there were a couple years in which the budget was late being passed so there was an extension given to everyone throughout the state and that was state was late passing the budget Miss berer so so I appreciate that I um I still am trying to to be clear and I see the schedules as proposed I see the corrections that came um many of them during the dayto day as

yall and last night as yall were feverishly working and I'm so appreciative of of that work and that respon responsiveness and um mistakes happen and so that is that's not a weakness I appreciate it I have been since our meeting previously hearing and conveying to folks that they will not see a decrease that they will at least see a 3% raise based on a previous email that they received I want to be conveying accurate information and so I'm looking to who I'm who has the answers in this space and I'm wondering one how many people might be on a scale that is reflected by the previous comp trollers work and that spark email and how many employees might be on these new scales do you all have some analysis of that because it feels like we've built two

systems that that are operating and then in the future will'll need to collide uh merge them so I will jump in to answer your question um board member buyer as well as um Miss price may have some other things to address with that I want to address the notion of our Legacy employees I want to make it clear because the board has not passed schedules yet even from what was proposed um what occurred in in March when our employees got their 11% all new hirees all classified new hires on those um pay grades have been processed the same way since then and so upon approval of compensation schedules right we have our leac employees and you are correct they get the 3% they maintain their

11% get the three % if they were reclassified they always they also get that difference okay so from approval of the compensation schedule whatever you know final product for those classified salary grades that would be for employees hired from that point on are existing classified employees would be paid based on that Legacy piece I would also say initially when the um items were posted that same looker Studio salary projection tool was showing the same information we went in and paired that down and to make sure that it is showing now this is what 2425 would be with that 3% in whatever reclassification you would have out of

I'm pulling those and I'm doing this off the top of my head but I'm pretty sure about this when I went through and did a formula to say how many have the same title same you know nothing's changed for them except perhaps us giving their bump right the there were about 1,300 that that information was still um the same for them there are a number that we may have to work on they may show up in the salary tool depending on when they were processed or or where they are that maybe they changed a job they got a promotion and they're still on one of those salary grades we are just double triple checking those individuals to make sure that their salary showing correctly Miss price did you have another answer to miss buyer's other question no pressure okay so thank you um I I was just going to add that the letter and the information that

was provided from previous work was not a scale so it was an actual they were given information we could not create a scale from that information because how that information was created we didn't have the math to do that so that is why we're proposing new schedules based on DPI and a a percentage increase to increase where DPS employees are starting because we couldn't backwards engineer what was given out in that information so the important thing for for employees to understand is the what they saw is what is being honored and budget and that's what Miss o Jo and I have been working on is making sure that financially that is that we we can do that and we're looking to ensure that we've got something in place for the future Dr Lewis can I ask you to speak

to um how the board is expected to engage with salary schedules and how we expected to answer people's questions when they have inquiries about their specific pay yeah we are preparing for some depending on the outcome of tonight preparing for some additional communication to go out tomorrow that will include information as relates to employees knowing where where their where they where their new classification is on the new salary schedule and additional ways that employees can sit down one-on-one with staff to go over um any additional questions or feedback uh that they may have about their their salary are you expecting board members to be able to answer individual questions for individual employees um in regards to their pay we're not expecting board members to be HR experts however we are um we will share information with with the board obviously so you'll know how to respond

to um staff that may come to you with a with a concern how however we want to create a space where staff is not getting to runaround where yes we would love staff to come to you but we don't want you to then send them back so we'll obviously share the information in terms of contact information and direction as to where they can go directly to get the answers but obviously we'll keep you updated and give you um um information that you can share back with them thank you Miss carteron I had some more questions when you get a chance thank you we'll come back to you um I have number of questions for you miss price thank you so much for such a clear presentation this evening um I um wanted to follow up on a few things to make sure that the whole board and anybody else watching this is clear on all of these pieces um can you help us uh by explaining how staff will be placed between the men's and Max's and and in the different grades when there are multiple grades for single positions

like when someone's looking at what's posted online now how do they find themselves um that's my and then maybe also can you explain what movement from year to year looks like both from a steps perspective and a salary perspective so these are great questions thank you for for asking we were asked to model salary schedules and those questions are part of implementation that to happen over time what I was told was the recommendation was that we needed to have mins and Maxes that was was recommended and so we have modeled that and we are working closely with HR to understand where people are currently and where or based on their legacy so we can put them on a schedule and move them appropriately to ensure that they can they can continue to progress in their career at the bottom of the salary schedules are the recommended what is in DPI those salary titles when I talked

earlier about customization in terms of what is within DPS there are many employees that may not see their job title in the bottom because their title is DPS specific however we wanted to show what the state does as we are working to ensure sustainability and Clarity and so that's why that is there so my recommendation has been and what we've talked about Dr L Miss o Jo and I is that we will have to spend time with individuals to understand their job the work that they are doing to place them correctly for continued growth in their career thank you um can you um as I know folks are um have questions about previous work um I know that when we had spoken we talked about steps and salary schedules can you verify were there

steps in the previous work that was in place or the previous work that and the results of the work that I saw there were no schedules created from the previous person that did the work and so and and again because we didn't see schedules created what we saw was a list of people moved with no formulas and no understanding of how that movement happened and when speaking with previous consultant the understanding that that work was predicated on the work before the other so and that was in question and so as an organization I didn't want to start from work that had already been in question we wanted to start from something that was mandated and that was public and already out there and that is and n cdpi and so we started from ncdpi created schedules and then moved

forward thank you Mr tab thank you very much um just a few thoughts and then a question um I can understand staff people's frustration um I really do understand that um what I would like from Administration Dr Lewis was possible that we get a clear understanding exactly what is now missing based on the emails there are different things that I'm hearing that is missing although when some staff people emailed me when they went back and looked they found Clarity they said okay I understand this now so there's got to be a way that we clearly understand what we need to fix who is affected by it so that we can start that process and then hopefully the turnaround for the um taking care of the psychologist and all them within 24 hours we can get everybody taken care in

that same amount of time or hopefully in a quick turnaround so that everybody will feel like we are doing that type of work to take care of and correct all of this and so that's what I propose if we could get that list of what actually is missing now from what the community and the teachers and the class classified employees saw based on the last thing so that we don't have to re reinvent the wheel again but just correct what's missing M trz um all right thank you so much um let's see I guess this is um well here's what I want to say first of all before I ask a question are we doing one question at a time okay um that I um I feel conflicted because um I don't want to negatively affect people's retirement I think that's very important

and um that's why we scheduled the meeting for tonight so that the salary schedules could go into effect tomorrow or be um entered in tomorrow and um so that the pay would come out um new pay would be um given um this month and um and and I really don't want to I don't like that we're in this situation uh period but I I really don't want to affect people's retirement um I also do wish we could have more time to flesh these out and fully um kind of wrestle with things the public has not had a lot of time with them um uh thank you for all that you've done in the short amount of time um I also want to say that one of the um most important important decisions we made recently as a board was to hire Dr Lewis and I do have faith in his ability to move us forward from this spot um

clearly we're still still you know feeling um this um this wave of um of uh I don't it's a smaller level crisis perhaps but this um you know lack of of transparency as people have raised and um clear information in a timely way um particularly particularly as it affects people's pay and um and so uh I do have faith in your ability to leave us lead us forward from this place um because of your demonstrated success and I um and so that's um and I appreciate you getting the resources and support we need we need um and needed to to do that quickly at this point um what I'm trying to understand still and I want everybody else to be able to understand is how we place people um I'm following up on Miss cardon's question how we place people on this scale is their Merit pay is their

pay based on performance at this point because there are mens and Maxes and then the midpoint which is written down um if we adopt these scales um how um I Heard miss priceon your answer that that needs to be evaluated but also we're turning in numbers my understanding is tomorrow so what um am I wrong about that let me ask about the timeline first of all because my understanding was the salaries needed to be decided tomorrow if we were to get in this pay period Well I I'll so this the salaries do we need to have the these in place so we can move forward for new employees the employees that received the spark email June 13th saw what was 2024 2025 plus 3% and they're getting that and so that that doesn't change in terms of what's

already been said because they got that with no scale no salary schedule what we originally were asked was create a schedule based on that and we could not do do that so these new schedules are to allow for consistency moving forward however the the financial commitment is already there and um I I want to ensure that everyone understands that the the the schedule and the pay are while they are important that they align in this moment for DPS because of where we are they are they're not they do not aign but that doesn't mean that people can are cannot understand that they're going to that the district is committing to do what they said they we that they would do that's already been promised the money that they said they're still going to get that and so the placement of people on these

schedules for their future is the work that we want to do systematically and individually so that we can ensure that people have growth as well because what we saw in terms of what we could see from pre previous work was because of the increases that were there based on their NC rate their grade they would not be able to move and so we want to be able to work with HR and work with the individual to understand their job to say this is where we can put you so that you can continue to get an increase based on what the board says and what the board votes on year over-year and they can see it and they'll know what that's going going to look like and so in an Ideal World the previous this work would have come with a scale and a schedule yet it didn't and we could not duplicate that work to create that does that clarify yes I think it it does let me see what my followups are um I say with regard to

the payment timeline um it typically takes two to three weeks to process the payroll there's a lot of manual entry in it so we had to go ahead and open up the September payroll so in order to get the Retros in we have to manually key those in so the weekend and the days of the week are going to be required for us to get all those hand keyed in to get those retro payments out so um we're coming up against some pretty tight timelines with actually being able to process the payment so and that's an example of when I say setting a system up for SE success when zerra has to go hand key in something you know um that's a piece of but I want to go back to something you shared I'm I came from a district where teachers would max out or employees would max out that's not a good feeling for employees and so we want to create a system where we want you to stay here for 50 years and you still can see some some level of of growth while also creating schedules that [Music] um put us in a fiscally responsible

place because and that accounts for compression as well which is really really huge and so and when I say put it in a a good place financially if our Maxes are above the state level Maxes we have to pull in local dollars to do that um and so it's a number of variables that come into play with really creating schedules that will allow for financial benefits for our employees and financial benefits for um the school system as well miss heral go um I just wanted to take a moment to um State what I'm understanding um and what I what I appreciate about um the work that's been done in the last

few days um what I'm understanding is that there is a schedule that is a living document that we have to begin to explore so that we can um have one place where this new transparent system um lives um and in order for us to be able to honor historically what has happened prior to this new system um we have that's kind of like the Band-Aid to hold things in place while we set up this new this new system so it it has nothing

to do with what was promised from um previous decisions prior to this those our our employees are going to receive what they were promised plus the 3% and so no one should be seeing anything that's below that that's less than what they were already receiving so that's the one thing this what's confusing or what was confusing that I'm trying to make sure I have Clarity on is that in order for us to get to that place transparency we have to be speaking the same language and um the system needs to be transparent enough so that um all of our stakeholders can look at it and see how it's how it's working and it's not completely it's it's what the

work that's been done right now has been set up so that we can begin operating in this new transparency system to avoid um all of that to avoid some of this miscommunication and all these things that have happened in the past and the more accurate or you know the more transparent that is and if it's set up properly with the right numbers and if everything and if we are educated to know how to reference it then we can begin to do the real work of seeking fully funded ideal fully funded Public Schools um so I'm feeling like um again just you know hearing all of the public comment and and the emails and um understanding that if we um if we're truly going to be speaking with

stakeholders we need to think about our meeting conferm we need to move that forward um in ways like this and and thinking about you know just how how the transparency works I'm seeing that um how do I say this I like the fact that it's a living record I would like to go ahead and move that forward and pass that so that we can begin to do this real work that we really can't do if we don't have if if we're not you know if if we don't clean up our systems for how we how we do these things so I see this as a real move forward to getting to those better systems that we all need and I don't want um the confusion and the lack of education and the the need for the transparency the conversations that haven't been had or any of that to get in the way of us doing this step because

this is one of the steps that's going to help us get closer to um to the work of what we really want which is fully funded public schools and um I think I'll stop there did you have any questions my question is around my understanding that this is a living document um I I want to this is a living document if we move to accept this today as a living document um my understanding is that it's what I'm seeing is I'm seeing it set up for historical record so we can see where it starts right now you know the the things are hypothetical if when things don't work we can go in and we can tweak it um um and so when we're making a vote today we're not voting on something that is a stagnant this is how it is this is how it's going to be we're making a vote on

something that is going to be developing and helping us to improve our systems of transparency so I just wanted to make sure that that is what this is not a stagnant model here this is a living document so yes the all of the schedules are live and will remain live and after a vote if the board votes to move forward then what will happen is the work that of we're we had a moment in time before we are now moving forward and the work to talk to individuals to understand what will the future look like all of that is work that has to happen along with philosophy um even today I've heard the the discussion around mens and Maxes and midpoints and all of that is methodology that's the word that I would use and that is a part of the work that that the board and others that they decide to bring that that you all decide to bring to tables to discuss and focus groups

Etc to determine what is the philosophy that Durham Public Schools wants to have when it comes to salaries and how does HR Implement that with employees and how does finance budget it and ensure that there is a future that has a sustainable future fiscally and I I just also wanted to acknowledge that we've also heard and and I wanted to say publicly that um we do believe that everyone who has a you know a master's relevant to their educational field should receive Master's pay we do believe that we have to have a transparent system and show how we're working to do that and it's not just that's something that doesn't just lie with the Board of Education that's something that we have to work with each other to make sure can happen thank you so much um I have a few clarifying questions um while we're still having

these conversations I am appreciative Miss Bry of your work Dr Lin Miss OG um I appreciate the efforts you've put into this work especially at the 11th hour I'm disappointed that we again find ourselves at the 11th Hour um I think my first question is um around Master's pay because we're talking about all the schedules right now right right [Music] um how many people are we thinking about in terms of relevant Master's pay experience and of the funds allotted from the County commission for Master's pay um how much of that is going to be exhausted

2 million yes but the actual ual number I'm I'm

2 million okay um I'm trying to think of what I can ask that's not a question for Dr L say while she's looking okay um so my follow-up question would

be the board's intent when we requested uh Master [Music] supplement might not exactly be um clearly executed in the current budget that we have um can you speak to some of those restrictions how we landed there um and what we can do going forward um if not this whether or not we can do something going forward this year and if we can't do something this year um what what do you need from the board and order to get us the necessary information so that we can fully assess our requests okay so I want to go back

and speak to the numbers just to give you an idea of where we are and how we um need to think about processing around Master's pay since the board meeting just the the clarity pieces from our board meeting last week I set up a meeting with with um my team and DPI ler just to talk some about um Master's pay and execution um at the state level and so one of the things that I would like to share as I'm still going to answer your numbers question and all of that is there is we it is truly advisable that we align to DPI processes and part of what you're hearing even from some the um individuals in here today is very legitimate um concerns even when you're looking at Master's pay processing at the state level and so I did um share in

an email with some of you some consideration when we're talking about relevancy relevancy to be approved as you can outside of the the 2013 provision I'm talking about just for Master's pay period you actually have two levels just to be explicitly clear of relevancy one we talked a lot last week about relevancy for the subject matter so if your Masters is for example in religious studies and you're teaching math you know the the payment on a master's degree is is not going to be deemed relevant there but there's another piece that's related to what is already on your license so you heard me reference even last week and in our meeting and just going through some specific examples that were presented um To Us by employees it is imperative that if we

are going to be aligned that is administrators um administration's recommendation is that it actually goes through um the DPI process but that relevancy is not only about that subject matter it is also what is on the license and so say for example if someone is a math teacher and they have math on their license and their Master's is in Science Education let me just use that as an example the state would not pay on that and so even for many of our employees who have a master's that meet that 2013 provision there are circumstances under which based on that graduate pay Provisions the state would not pay and

so I do think we have a crucial while it is re um administration's recommendation that we follow DPI guidelines it would be a district you know a board decision to operate um in a wider scope than that to address some of the complications that you will find with awarding graduate pay from the state example and so the total number of employees that we identified actually with a masters before going through the relevancy piece is actually 230 seven okay once we address the relevancy piece based on the submissions that we have and the classroom teacher context this is not expanded to cover all of those other areas um you are looking at to the best

of our assessment you're looking at about 189 thank you when do you expect to share that with um Finance so that they can Implement those pay increases so we have uh Outreach to the the difference in that 189 and the 237 we want to be able to ask those employees some additional questions but other than that the other individuals have already you know they are cleared um for Master's pay and so what we would um hope to be able to do is it's just a list that we would be able to share based on the information we have right here um that list has already been shared but we just need the clarity of who has cleared okay just for clarification will that be staff action forms

or I I think that that's a functional um piece that we can collaborate on outside of the board meeting okay can you share um DPI guidelines for the other positions for uh relevant Master's pay are you asking me to share that in writing or in this meeting in this meeting that to share guidelines for every other area would be extensive and I would have to go and pull those re it when I talk about ler being an individualized piece I would literally have to go for each of those areas and be able to pull that information for you that's helpful so in March when we started mentioning that we wanted Master's pay um should we have brought those questions to you at that time or should

we have expected an understanding from Administration as to which um designated job categories are eligible for Master's pay so with the expansion Beyond classroom teacher that what the actual language from that meeting centered on classroom teacher and that's a very different lens than looking at um some of the other areas I can give you some basic examples but to ensure 100% accuracy for everything is a literal detailed look at individuals when you're looking at graduate pay approval but even for some of the individuals that like social workers there is a way for social workers to still get paid on their masters from the state but there are nuances to where that program is what other it depends on the school it depends on what's on the license it depends on numerous factors

and so to project just G enal information I think that that would actually lead to more confusion from individuals is what I'm saying and the work that was done by Administration was based on that explicit language even though now we we we've had other discussions of classroom based teachers that's helpful um I appreciate that thank you for sharing um I do realize and recognize that as a board we have to work better to bring consensus in clear and specific Direction um for administration to follow we will work harder uh towards that goal um you may see my colleagues and I uh making motions that are more nuanced and uh more specialized so that we make sure that we're giving clear direction to Administration about expectations um and I guess this is an opportunity to apologize to um all of

our employees that have been working with a master's not getting that Master's pay uh our intent was not realized here and in this budget and it has had an impact on the morale within the district um and we are apologetic for that but we look forward to uh getting this information so that we can advocate for better funding for uh the relevant Masters pay in those situations my one last question Miss price um can you share with us when you um learned about the local supplements for certified staff that that was expected to be included in the schedules and why wasn't included in the schedules previously uh yes so our Focus was on classified for most of the work and once classified schedules were posted and the

feedback was where where where where where we had worked previously the first three days on getting a model together related to DPI and DPI and that's what was seen and so when The Angst and and again I do apologize for that that was that was that was never the intent and I do understand the impact of that um we then said okay what is the supplement and let's add it in and one of the actions tonight for the board is around is there going to be an increase related to and that is what's on the footer of the salary schedules because the information we received was that there's a proposed $80 per month supplement increase however the board has to vote on that and then we can add that to the model and so as soon as we found out for those that are listening for those that were online and I saw some of you as I was as we were working last night um we

took those down we made the corrections got the information added it to the schedules and then reposted them thank you that's helpful um and slps are certified yes yes and they're expected to get that uh supplement have they previously received the supplement Dr was say you mean the local suppl supplement yes yes okay I just want to make sure um colleagues Mr Tab and then I'll come back to inspire thank you just for clarification um Dr lassain who determines the relevancy of Master pay is that DPI or does Durham public schools in his HR have any discretion of Master's pay that is determin if you're submitting for the state to pay by NC DPI our lure analysts review before

submission based on the rules from um DPI but DPI could approve or they could deny in the case of denials there is also an appeal process that an individual may go and and appeal the ruling of of DPI there is a process for that and does at any point does DP does DPS Advocate on behalf of any employees for Master's pay all the time as a matter of fact in this review in our meeting with DPI I think this is very important I took the example of one of our folks that is in one of our employees who is in a category um that is not a classroom based teacher and that scenario had some nuances to it and we actually shared with DPI that example trying to see is there a way in the interpretation of policy that this could be covered and so

there are many instances where we are advocating on um behalf of employees when we feel that a rule doesn't feel fair to us um and we want to try to see if there's a way that we could get that individual Master's pay yeah thank you and so please keep that in mind for people who move from classroom or other position and become interventionist or you know decide to be Specialists uh we want to make sure that we Advocate to make sure that that Master's pay continues for them thank you Miss bu then miss Travis so thank you all I part of the deja vu that is um in that I'm wrestling with is last year's model that we were assured that we had funds when we took a rushed

5 for classified staff and so G I don't know if that's you I don't know what what models have you run run triple checked to give us all the assurance that that both the emails that folks have received

which I believe IS300 people from what y'all said earlier that will stay there unless I misunderstood that and then the folks that have come since and will be on these new schedules what's the financial impact how can we rebuild trust with folks that feel like we're not putting every we received into our employees how can is there anything you can tell us show us that helps us move forward with that there is some outstanding work to be done with position control and Staffing allotments that I'm you know working diligently with my colleague in HR to work out and as we work toward finalizing the budget resolution we'll be able to model that out dollar for dooll to show um the models that we've run currently are more of an Apples to Apples comparison just looking at a particular group of employees we pulled out the classified employees and compared the salaries there um as far as overall affordability um that will be more definitively decided as we finalize the actual budget resolution and bring

that to you um and that's after that position control and Staffing alotment work has been completed there's currently a Reconciliation that Dr King and Dr Lin are working with with the schools um to shore up the um enrollment numbers and the allotments that they have and I just think we'd be better positioned to tell you about really give you an adequate picture of the staff once that work's been completed okay so upcoming Dr L um when the reconciliation what are your dates on that the reconciliation does not stop the budget planning but as we have said before based on our allotment which actually looks very favorable now um we are over the our threshold of ADM and Dr King and I have been working together and um notices have gone out to schools

and those schools that um may be under ADM and we have to shift employees that work is occurring next week once we have a better picture of what vacancies are truly in the schools and what what our staffing needs truly are then Finance can cost out those staffing needs and give you an adequate picture of what the budget looks like okay I'm gon follow up um have we ran a model of what payroll looks like if we Implement these salary schedules or the staff that were identified in the salary projection tool yes can you share with us what that is if it's on target to keep us on budget yes the model that run with those with that cohort of employees it is

on pathway but that is isolated to comparing the salaries that's not taking into consideration other things in the budget that may affect the budget overall I'm just interested in the person in out budget right now there are some over allotments um and the shifting of the way we fund certain employees such as the ones that are unlicensed that have been shifted to fund two um has kind of skewed what our previous models were so until the reconciliation occurs and we know where every staff member Falls it's difficult for me to tell you that this is how much we're expending in fund two because that amount could change if we over spend in September are y'all coming back to us in October and asking us to change people's pay no well if we overspend it in

September so as I talked about earlier one of the key findings around the confusion and one of the things that to ensure that what we've modeled we can look for and one of the things that we discussed was we will not be we can we can for sure say to current employees you're going to keep your pay and as the budget is in question as there's lots of work around salary uh around excuse me position controls and vacancies Etc there will be conversations around how do we balance the budget if there are vacancies can we fill them should we hold off other strategies that can be implemented and so as I'm listening that that's that would be the recommendation is to know that what we've modeled we can afford and we won't have to come back to the board to say we're going to reduce salaries and that doesn't mean the total budget we might not have to make adjustments to but we can do that in other ways there's there's lots of ways to ensure that Sal salaries stay current

and there are other things that we do um with vacancies attrition Etc to balance the budget um Miss Chavez and Miss card okay I will just add on to this um were you gonna say something else okay I wanted to add on to this piece of the conversation just to say I doo am interested to see the numbers as as soon as possible um thank you for working through that also um it's very important that we just heard what we've modeled we can afford um I want to say that I also um I just want to say I apologize on behalf of our district also for the crisis around or the mini crisis but um around the um the uh slps and um spee speech th um psychologist ideologist um pay being

off part of that is you know I'm glad thank you we fixed that but um I'm sorry for the experience that people had this week around that um I also wanted to say speak to Master's pay so um I I want to express that I also the Board needs information to make educated decisions we would have benefited from having context about what all positions are included in teachers and instructional staff and social workers I'm I empathize with people um in the position of not being included in classroom teachers um I mean and I want to say I just completed my own MSW degree and it was uh it's a lot of work so um and we are thankful for the social workers um and all that you do for the um for our students we um I guess I want to make a motion around that um because I would like to um I would like to uh

move that we ask Administration to model out Master's pay for other um other workers on the teachers and instructional on the certified scales um who are not classroom teachers with the uh who have students in power school um and um that we have that modeled out so we can see what we're looking at what that would cost us how many individuals we're talking about um it was our intention to be inclusive and um and I regret that we did not uh calculate fully what it would cost to include all those individuals in our budget um I'd like to second that motion okay oh yeah I forgot it it's been moved by Miss travez seconded by Miss Carter uton to ask Administration to model out Master's pay for certified Educators that are paid on the teacher

scale is there any further discussion my discussion would be um I will I will support the motion but I also want to be very cognizant that the this was requested in a line it amount this year and um you heard the uncertainty of our entire budget in the last question that I posed and so the modeling may be for future district for future budget asks it may not be this year and I just don't like giving anything that we do from this Das that gives people false hope about about that um so while I'll support the motion I I don't know that I don't want to give the false impression that it might be budgetable this year um my it's my discussion I just was having some discussion Miss Rogers thank you I was going to respond to your

discussion miss berer this is absolutely a request to be modeled for our advocacy for next year's budget it is not to give false hope for this year or to change a budget for uh Master's pay this year any further discussion I just wanted to state that in this as um chair Roger said earlier we are trying to be intentional about taking specific actions and providing clear direction to Administration and this is one step in that direction in the past we've asked for things that were kind of like this and not demonstrated consensus on that and that's why I think Miss um Chavez suggested this and so I think to see how many staff are in each qual ifying category and what that would cost us um is what we need in order to think about this decision moving forward in a thoughtful way any further discussion Miss Harold gof I would just um you know as someone

who's new to these kinds of budgets and how to understand them um I'm curious about how um all of this would play out in the course of like how budgets move forward for the following year like how soon we would is this a part of an of of something that we can clean up as we're thinking about this Motion in a system um of having certain information prior to budget discussions that's an excellent question Miss heral go um generally we start collecting information about what we're looking for in a new budget start having discussions November December so that uh the superint attendant can engage with the county manager and um board members can start engaging with County Commissioners around what our advocacy will be when we can have conversations with uh stakeholders constituents about the

needs that we're seeing come up in school buildings and across the district and other departments and use that information to make the best decision and then come April March and April the superintendent can put together a informed budget request and present that to the board we will approve it or make changes to it and approve it and then take it across the street to make that request to the County Commission adopt it as the board's budget so is this motion um that Miss Chavez is has put forward would that is that an additional piece of information is there a list of all the different things we need to consider um prior to is is there something like that that exists is this something that's being added to of you know things asks for the staff that they that we would need to receive prior to November is that what I'm

understanding okay and I'm I'm just curious as to what other things that would be impactful you know in the budget what other things do we need to be aware of so that we can have it prior to these budget discussions happening in November that's that's all but I do support this motion we will continue to have those discussion oh Dr Lewis thank you so much I just want to get clarity on I heard um all teachers with Masters or is there other categories you want us to bring back and when we look at bringing that back and muling that out do you want us to follow the state's model for example in the past you've heard us say in this room relevant Masters those that are have a master's in you're teaching math and you have a master's in math State model is you spend 50% of your time teaching the subject you got the Masters in so I just want to be crystal clear on the ask in terms of employee levels you want us

to bring back and if you want us to follow the state's U model and if I can if I can add we we may want to Define what we mean by teachers in in this context because as we know there are there are a number of other folks in our district who consider themselves teachers and are paid on the teacher scale um that that we would just want to be very clear about I mean are we including instructional coaches are we including instructional um other instructional support staff I just want to make sure we um are fully aware of of everybody who might be included in in this category yes and I can assist with that definition if you would like we would like to know everybody pts OTS everybody

that has a master's degree that could get paid for their relevant master's degree and break it down in job categories so we can cost it out for what we and decide specifically what we're asking for so classified or certified skill that would be individuals paid on the classified scale I just want to be aware of this yes everybody classified and certified everybody and at risk in job categories I'm not saying we're gonna get it all I'm not saying we're gonna ask for it all yeah yeah but we want to see the numbers you you you you used the word relevant just a minute ago I just want to make sure you don't actually want us to think about it in terms of relevancy as the state defines it you mean everybody who has a master's degree that's relevant I'm sorry right so again when when you say that's relevant that triggers a definition and

what I'm asking is okay I want everybody we want everybody there you go we want everybody and then we want a definition of relevant perfect thank you thank you Mr tab so that was one of the reason I brought up the question that I brought up about who decides because when we started I was in the building I can tell you everybody that has a master's degree in that building is relevant and they gonna think that everybody is so I think we need to be just very clear on what this board wants in terms of of what is relevant and who is deciding whether or not is relevant and I want as a former teacher I would want everybody in that building to be paid if they have a master's degree to pay it but the state does not say that so we got to decide as a board do we go outside of the state requirement and decide are we going to spend that kind of budget and money to

take care of everyone now I'll be for it but if we don't have the money we can't we can't do it but I defin would be for it but I just want to make sure that we are very clear on that because being in that building I I know how we felt so that's my that's it absolutely and um knowing we may not have the money we just need the information to make the decisions and without it we are flying by the seat of our pants and we don't want to do that anymore Miss Chavez thank you for the clarifying question question I appreciate that because we want we want that and um and we would like the context of who does DPI pay for who do they not all of that so I just wanted to add that to asteris or whatever just to show us like um the full context um okay that's it so all of that I think is part of the motion I appreciate this discussion it to me shows us

um why I actually think that our administrators should lead these budget discussions and bring it from their informed role to this board not not us actually handpicking some employees over others so I I look forward to when it comes um also coming with with a recommendation from Dr Lewis and his team about what they think we should do with that information um knowing um that we want it all in Durham right we want it all on behalf of every single employee it's not coming from the state and we are we are torn with maximizing the impact on students with limited local resources and um we want it all on y'all's behalf and on our students behalf so I look forward to when it comes coming with with informed

expertise from our administrators thank you SCA Aton I appreciate that Miss buer um I agree and I look forward to when we have a meet and confer policy and we can have the informed opinion and perspectives and experiences of our staff to also help inform our budget asks and all the decisions that we're making is there any further discussion okay yep uh motion from Miss Chavez seconded by Miss Carda-Auten to ask Administration to model out Master's pay for both certified and classified

employees um and come with definitions all employees yeah um all those in favor say I I I I I all opposed say no it carries 6 so um colleagues we still have to make a decision about the schedule tonight miss Travis and Miss Carter Aden okay thank you I'm still trying to understand um and all right so so someone starts next week um what is how is it determined how will it be

determined I know you're how will it be determined where someone is placed next week on the scales or so I will give voice to that if you're and my assumption let me check my assumption first is that you're talking about the classified salary schedules yes um where you have men's and Maxes yeah the the uh let's get a clear point that the men's and Maxes was designed to address the concept that you know the board had worked its way through with some of the prior work instead of that men and Max being for an entire scale that was in the methodology that was assigned at every step what we would look to do just making sure that we are covered for our um new employees coming on is if you go to that

column and you just think of that midpoint column as the step you're aligned it meets the science and all of that and so if you come in you're assigned at step five then that midpoint column you could really actually redesign the the scale where that is the First Column and that would be more um aligned with what our employees are used to seeing the men's and Maxes still assist with as you're looking for year to year and trying to adjust where that point could be set you just want to make sure that that methodology is followed down through the entire scale if I may also I do want to give voice to our salary Pol our salary Administration working group and it is cross departmental cross position um and they're very hardworking group and so

we've kind of been waiting for our teachers that are on the um group to get back from summer so we kind of took a small um Hiatus we're going to be back meeting um starting next week and just continuing that work but kind of the conversations that we've had in the last week and what we've learned from Eerie success is also going to inform that work and so I think I to some extent I would say um I agree with what Dr L is saying to some extent but I do want to give allow that working group to inform kind of how what the process looks like for placing people on that scale so it's kind of still um just really focusing and moving towards more transparency more Equity more accountability for how we place people when they are hired uring public schools and having that be informed by that diverse group right of different voices and different lenses to make sure that it's not just you know what me or

Dr laain may look and think so that's kind of what I would say at this point um and just um I know it's taking us a little while on that policy but we want to get it right and we're putting the work in so the short answer to me um would be that as we work through the salary Administration policy and get that guidance and make sure that we put in place the different objective steps that also allow for Equitable subjectivity and placement so that when people come in it's done in an appropriate way that aligns with that policy after the board adopts it so but in the obviously the policy is not adopted but we do have 7501 which kind of sets out those broad guidelines and so it would be expected that staff and the HR department would follow those broad guidelines that the board has issued regarding salary Administration um so with Okay so this group will deter determine the criteria

for placement is that correct what the group will determine is a recommendation to this group sure what okay so yes correct okay and then um uh let's see here so in the meantime we are using the midpoint is that correct that is correct because we have new employees every day okay so after after approval after approval then this would then anybody who starts between now and when we um approve this the salary Administration working group's policy recommendation would be placed at the midpoint I think that all those decisions are based on budget as well so I mean one of the reasons we have the men's and Maxes is to make sure that we can support that salary right and encumber it and so I think it would obviously that goes with different positions so depending on what the grade

is what that midpoint is and what has been allotted for that position budget budgetarily so I think that it would be I don't know that I would be comfortable saying to the board and maybe Dr lay is but I would not be comfortable saying to the board definitively where any particular person would be placed without looking at the scale and the position and that person's experience so and and to that point let me take what I'm speaking to miss Chavez is the the notion of having that this step this point we have to get there but it does Dr Giovani is correct and thank you for that it does have to be vetted against the budget um first what that actual dollar out would be so I'm just still trying to get a grasp on what someone can expect if they are a new employee what they can expect

because I don't know how what the criteria are at this moment and so that's what I'm trying to understand and um and also I guess I'm wondering why we might not have that budgeted out if we know how many vacancies and and that kind of thing so the current piece that we use as a qualifier upon hiring someone on that classified scale are there verified years of experience that is the one factor that determines your placement on the scale but right now that is only one access sorry access um and the other is this minmax thing so that's what I still can't wrap my head around please help me to understand that's what I I I do not want to pass something that I don't understand correct and so where what are we saying what would be the criteria for placing someone on between mens and Maxes I

understand the years of you know we know verified years of experience we want to continue to honor that how we need to know I I feel that we need to know you know how we're placing people can I um take a moment um well chair Rogers has stepped out I wanted to see if um Finance staff wanted to speak to this could answer these questions and also I think relatedly help us um and the community understand when what the timeline will look like for when we will be able to um make the decisions that are needed um for the next steps of all of all of this Finance has been working with HR to solidify our data set it is no secret that our system is Antiquated we simply just don't have the data set to give you good numbers um going through trying to decide from the payroll assignments document what's current what's relevant

which assignment to cost out I mean that's something I've been working with Dr L with for some months now um and waiting so when that is received Finance can give you good numbers on these are the employees that work here at these sites these these are the vacancies that we have we can use the midpoint to cost it out but with that Staffing allotment piece in the position control piece influx it's hard for finance to give you definitive data when we don't know who we're costing I I would like to clarify that HR has shared the document the most recent document includes our current payroll at 5,18 employees I think we also frequently share um vacancy as well as other information that is requested we should have enough information to be able to provide the

additional projections that are being requested by the board thank you uh board members oh I'm sorry I had this same question that Miss Chavez did and I still have it do you still have it Miss Chavez like yes okay so is there anyone that can like walk us through why there's a difference of person with five years of experience on the scale there's a Min and a Max how are you all going to place people fairly equitably on a scale um last week when I was speaking with the board and we talked about men's and Maxes the what what I heard and what my team heard was that men's and Maxes is what the board wanted and I talked about bias I use that word bias because it is

in there which is why as we modeled these schedules we put a midpoint in place so there would be transparency in what a minut and Max Prov slides and as a board tonight as you're looking at the schedules and as you're as you're advising as what we can do there are different levers around how these salary schedules can be implemented if you choose to as as I'm listening now the understanding of what a Min and a Max is is now becoming clear to everyone that's on the board right now and it is the understanding that without these policies and procedures in place the ask that was provided to model these salary schedules off of is was unclear as to what that lever what that would do so if the board is now wondering what do mens and Maxes do and how do we make those decisions and we need policies and procedures in place

the schedules are set up so that if the board decides we want to go closer to a minimum we want to go at a midpoint we want to we want want R we want Erie success to design it and take out the difference and do a multiplier of we can do that what I the reason I'm I'm speaking so frankly is because the clarity around the ask around model for mens and Maxes and the implications of that is important and and again previous work was men's and the recommendation was men's and Max is only with no steps which would create even more challenges which is why we built it in with steps and so as a board tonight and if necessary we can model it that if if there's uh uncertainty around the implementation and time that's that

is being recommended as well isn't there then this doesn't have to be an all or nothing it can be the beginning of of what we can do moving forward and so if there's uncertainty uh around mens and Maxes then you could say can you take the mens and maxes out and give us a midpoint only or give us a percentage above the minimum to get us closer and we can start there and I just want to create that Clarity because as someone again new I've I've listened to the requests go back and forth without the understanding of what you're asking and what the implications are in in terms of implementation and those are all very different things well and you've got men's and Maxes in these bands I mean in your tables but we also have talked about State men's and Maxes and those are yeah so the state only gives a men and Max with no steps and so all of that is a part of the word that Dr Lewis is gonna get tired of me saying

methodology and the methodology then goes to policy and procedure and implementation and the and that is across both functions and so we we won't be able to solve this problem that is existed tonight however we can provide a starting place and if the board is UN if if the board is is uncertain around what mens and Maxes are and how to really Implement them then the guidance could be we would like to implement the salary schedules without them and give us a set point or that percentage that's why the number is there and we can do that Miss Harold go um I understood the men's and Maxes last week to be something that was there to give us the flexibility to finish the process with the system and um would feel uncomfortable like knowing what that number is currently to say this is

the midpoint and have it like that um it is not ideal it's it it could cause some Equitable issues to have that available but right now what it does is it gives us the opportunity to finish the process you know and still be able to implement a salary schedule and and be able to not risk um whatever impacts it would have on our you know retired employees um this is a living document that is my understanding that's why I keep asking that question I feel like we need to start a process for a new system with something to work with um and I don't think that we should delay um pushing something that is a transparent document that everyone can see that we are working on and so um I would like to make a motion for us to go ahead and approve the salary schedule that we have so that we can continue working on this new transparent system

because if we don't we're still working with something that is not transparent we're still working you know and and we're we're in the same place these questions are all valid questions there's a lot of holes a lot of things to work with but what I like about it is that it is it is an Open document it is something that can be seen that that that the public can see that we're working on it's something that we can receive more feedback on it's it's a historical document so it's showing here moving forward it's going to be that kind of um gives that kind of flexibil ability and it also it makes us vulnerable it it it's going to put us on the spot to really do the work so I would like to make the motion to move forward and approve um the the the work that has been done so that we can have something to work with one

second it's been move by Miss Harold G second dat by Miss Carter aen to approve the salary schedule presented tonight so that we can move forward um with vulnerability and accountability um is there any discussion Miss Chavez Mr tab Miss Carter we're just going to go down the line um is this motion then to to approve the schedules with the mens and Maxes that's what you're saying or not with the midpoint midpoint as the a starting point because I think what I heard was we could choose that potentially as the part of the salary schedule my understanding was that if we my understanding of the men's and Maxes is that it gives us flexibility to

really examine it you know it gives us wiggle room to be able to get to that place of this is what it is if we take it out and we're starting with that then I guess we could still have that discussion but I don't I don't find any conflict right now with where we are in the process with the men's and Maxes okay um of course it there's no like Clarity like the questions that we're asking like okay so when somebody comes in and what does that mean where do they start you know that's a valid question I would like to explore that question with this living Open document when would I guess my question would just be when would we know what the actual scale is because I I I'm open to a process and you proposed Miss price a process that would um which I liked over you know the next couple years to really fine tune all of this um and get input and and all of that

I still have the same question about next week someone comes in they have five years of verified experience where do they land how do we know it's Equitable in the next two weeks how many people are we going to hire I don't know but how how do I know that you know one person isn't hired with five years of experience at 1849 um 8 1849 an hour and the other person is hired at 2225 an hour how do I know I mean I just don't I don't know so it feels too loose to I don't understand it right now okay my to answer your question we we said we would be honest and vulnerable to get us to where we need to be and I did hear in public comment that that was what was needed the truth is is you don't know and you've never known except for the schedules and the information that was provided previously was behind a curtain and so because it was behind a curtain before it wasn't scrutinized and

now that it is public and it is seen it is being asked for now when the truth is is that you've had it before and this G gives us an opportunity to create policies practices and implementation to take that bias out but it will take time so to answer your question how will you know if there's bias there's been bias and the reason we are creating transparency is so that the dis the decisions as to how this is happening moving forward can be in policy and practice and accountability is there I mean what I'm wondering is it possible to to um pass these with a more concrete number but leave it open you know so that you all can still do your process all for that and then we have have a more concrete more you know based on your work we have a a

different um scale in a few months that's a question for the board to decide Miss Carter atton sorry just to follow up on that to clarify it's my understanding that this is step one feels like step 500 this is step one we have to do we have to do this we're approve we would be approving the ranges right the mens and the Maxes the midpoint is just the Middle Point that's we are not deciding tonight where people are placed and yes that it feels um uncertain for tomorrow and the next day but then this board together is going to take the next step with guidance from our experts here in the room to decide how we place people on these schedules not just time but what our system is and what our and that's going to be in policy and in procedures and so I guess

my question is when can that happen what's the soonest that could happen based on um our meeting schedule and what you all need and the constraints that are in place so that we can know how long we'll be living in this like um what feels like a limbo period I think Vice chair caught just a quick question how soon can the policy be brought or how soon can e success gonna start modeling some other things which just to clarify I think I need to know both um based on what ER success can tell us and miss o Joe and Dr Len can tell us on what they need in order to be able to place people so it sounds like we already we already approved one policy which is the overarching what do we call it guidelines Vision um and then we need to approve the next level of policy and a set of procedures to go alongside that is that

correct Mr tab wants to talk but colleagues I'd like to offer some information he has he has something he wants to say uh but I want to ask [Music] um as we want the policy to be data informed right um I hate to put her on the spot again Dr Lin can you tell us on average how many people we would hire between now on average how many people would be hired between now and say January we are actually on the back end of the extremely busy um season and typically around this time of year on the approval report you're probably looking usually typically we have

anywhere from 30 30 to 40 people when we level out on Personnel report so I would project out from there and if you have [Music] two okay I would I would have to look at some data to definitely say that you could be talking about um a couple 100 people because remember you have people leave and new people coming in okay so then I guess my question would be can we take the data of the people who have been hired over the last three months and put them where they would be on the schedule if the schedule had been approved so that we can use that information to inform where people the how we create the policy right look at that data yeah plot them yes that's exactly what I was saying can we plot them that's what you're asking yes so that we can use that information to inform where they go

but knowing that we have to approve the schedules in order to plot them so that it can inform so you pick your period of time you pick just plot them put them on the schedule bring that to us so we can understand how that how the indicators in that PL plot inform the policy and board members at risk of an injection the board could also direct that all staff members who are hired between now and the time at which um this process is um created would be hired at the midpoint and after the process was created we could then go back and make sure that those people are placed appropriately based on the procedure that we create um that would provide the board with an opportunity to ensure a minimum level of equity at the start of

the process um and allow us time to develop uh the process that we'll need to have in place in order to appropriately place um uh incoming staff or you could suggest the mid the bottom point or the high point but I would suggest the midpoint I think board members I would just maybe I appreciate what Dr King is saying I would like to have um Miss price you know she's working with us and as we you know this was kind of a starting point just to make sure that we are finishing this process or completing this process with authenticity and I'm sure that there may be some other kind of tweaks that need to be done with her expertise so I would request maybe that the board maybe allow us to work with her because she's got a lot of experience kind of with the men's and Maxes in that placement to assist Administration with those conversations around placement and so kind of with Dr Le's permission just to kind of keep working with her to make sure that as we wait for the policy and the data Etc

that Erie success kind of assist us with making sure that what process we are using to place people is Equitable so that would be my kind of feedback Mr tab Miss travez Miss bu I'm Sorry Miss haral go thank you um with this motion I am torn part of it works for me and another part does not I I'm not clear if we're making a motion to to move forward with uncertainty and we have to take out the uncertainty for employees so saying that we're going to still be vulnerable I don't I don't particularly like that as a school district that we're continuing to put out there that we're vulnerable and that that we still going to be working on things and working on it and people are not clear on what's going to happen I want clear direction of exactly what we're going to

do how we're going to do it and it's very transparent so some some easiness for me um and those are my reasons but I like I like the fact that we're trying to move forward but I don't like the the fact that we're not clear totally on still being uneasy about what's happens in the next week or the week and I think um Dr giovan you said something about a team meeting coming up soon you know maybe we can Institute that in it and give a timeline on when some things will will happen so that people know exactly what's supposed to occur um absolutely um Mr tab I will when I go back I'll make sure I understand that but um what I would say I think when we were doing this um Mrs price had shared that and I think she's talking to Mr Malone right now but I just want to make sure that she um Miss price had shared that based on kind of the practice is the expectation really is to kind of start

more towards the minimum on these but what that gives you that space over like let's say you get somebody and you hire them and correct me if I'm wrong because she's the expert I'm just parting what she said but that that kind of gives you that space in a year when you have someone who comes in and just is awesome and that way they don't just kind of sit there maybe for a year like there's that Merit piece that I think she had mentioned before so kind of that it is kind of the practice that you start towards the minimum when you're hiring people and then they don't have to wait for another step or to maybe get to another grade they can come in and like they get there and they just give it at all and they're really just amazing you could then because it's in that men and Max and you've budgeted it to the midpoint because that's how we budget it they could then maybe move to that midpoint and so there is some incentive um for folks so so U Mr Price have please expound on that so in looking at the budget and what we know now and what we still need to

know the the recommendation to start at a minimum allows the district to be fiscally responsible right now knowing that we can continue to move forward however if the board directed for a midpoint we could do that which is why we wanted all of the math to be there when I started this work I said to Dr Lewis I actually don't recommend mens and Maxes that was my first statement when I got here and then the directive was the board wanted to see men's and Max's and so that's why we modeled men's and Maxes because that's what was talked about last week and so that's that's why I'm saying to the board the discussion around what the methodology will be and what the implementation is is a part of the decisions that the board has to make and I'm I'm getting here and and want to ensure that you understand when you're asking for something that you understand what that means and so the uncertainty Mr tab that you have is the uncertainty

as an expert that I came to the district with understanding that what was previously recommended and what the guideline of what to build was based on and what the directions were that we followed was not the recommendation that I gave to Dr Lewis when I first met him and so I want to be clear about that because what we do now and what we do next are a part of our path forward in the decisions that create that consistency and so it is um it it's disheartening I know for those that are listening to go why are we having this conversation and why didn't I know this and and the truth is because I wasn't here but now that I'm here I'm going to tell you and be honest and transparent with you around the things that you're asking for and the Implement implications of them I think about them as levers if if you're asking as an

expert for me to pull these levers it's my responsibility it's my duty it's my it's who I am and who my team is to tell you when you do this this is the impl implication of that and that's the work that we've been doing over the last 15 days is to get clear on when we do this that coin what's the implications of that and to whom and that's the only reason I said yes to this job because every other consultant would say no and people did say no and I said yes because we have to get there so if if if there's something you want us to do different tonight we can do it if there's something you want us to do different next we can maybe um I agree with well I miss um board member sh Chavez said so is there an amendment maybe to what you were saying to the motion that we can get us to where we need to be that's do I have to make it I did want to make an amendment to the

motion um I had a question first and my question is um what I heard I heard a recommendation that starting at the men making the men the um the line would be more fiscally responsible based on what we know right now because there's still variables based on what we know right now if we started at the mid there is the potential that then we could say this and then have to go down you could or what I I like to think about it the other way so if you start at the minimum and then like so many other school districts do as they prepare for the end of the year you have the opportunity to then if you de side and you have budget you could then do something else in local you could do a supplement or other things and I know that there are Benchmark districts that DPS likes to talk about and their salary schedules are posted and all of that however you don't know all the math and

then you also don't know implementation and those things are very different and so the understanding that yes we want to do it all and we want it all for DPS however we can't do it all right now but we can certainly set ourselves up to get that all in increments in the future So based on that hearing discussion I would like to amend my motion that we approve the salary schedule um starting at the with the men and remove the the you could remove the max start with an start with the men um for the purpose because um at working with this transparent system again I'm G push back on the

vulnerability which will that vulnerability for me is trans it's it's not about vulnerability in a way that makes us look like you know like we don't we're we're asking for it's no it's it's more of we're being vulnerable to be more transparent so that we're you know these voices are going to speak they can see the actions that we're doing so for the purpose of moving forward I would like to make a motion to um to approve this salary schedule with the men and not the men in Max you mean approve the salary schedule and anybody hired before we make the next set of decisions will be placed at the the men okay that what you're trying to do I like that better yes um all right so again let me restate it again try this again I'm making a motion to approve the salary schedule and

to um with new staff coming in while we're while we're going through the processes starting at the men new hires at the men until the next step just to clarify keeping the steps keeping the steps I just want to make sure because that that we want to be clear with the steps as well so we're not we're not permanently removing the mens and Maxes we are approving the salary schedule um with the men's and Maxes um understanding that new hires right now for the sake of preserving some Equity will start at the men's until we have further

analysis is there a second second we're voting on the amended motion and then we have to vote on the actual motion a friendly Amendment it's been moved by Miss heral go seconded by Miss Chavez to approve the salary schedule with men and Max and starting new hires at the minimum until we have further analysis is there any further discussion Mr tab just for the board but what we are voting on is it clear to the public what we are voting on and what we are saying I want to make

sure that this motion is clear to them what are you you know just so here's where I am paing to the chair I'm here with an uh motion to approve the schedule as is with an understanding that until we have further analysis that new hires are being placed on the scale of the minimum salary in a few minutes I'm going to ask for another motion to increase the um supplements and to proove uh the EC and ESL supplements because we need to be crystal clear about what we are approving okay Miss Travis did we vote on our earlier motion directing staff we did okay just making sure um and then um my question before we uh vote on this um how long have we contracted with Erie success and what is that Arrangement and I do want

to say also that this is a contract with not between the board but between um Administration and eie success so yes for how for how much longer we had a 30-day September September 4th through the end of September okay and um do um will we have an do we have an update will we have an update on um whether we will continue to work with Erie success or is that something you can share now or share next week yeah based on the results of tonight and the actions um in direction from the board we can go back tomorrow to see um if there will be additional time needed or if she can continue to work weekends and nights for by the 30th which I don't recommend but Mr Malone looks like he wants to say something I just I mean I'm sure you

guys are following all of this but I do think that at some point you have all of your existing employees that you'll need to address because this motion only deals with people that you're hiring starting tomorrow um so you need to deal with the 3% State raise and whatever else you're doing with your kind of your legacy employees and your staff may have a better description of what that is but just don't forget you've got to deal with I have a whole list okay great just making sure any further discussion m buer so um I'm so appreciative of your work I I'm not clear when this board had the the discussion and made the decision to to choose published salary schedules when the com

controller's recommendation was actually to to leave Folks at Men's and Max's and then go Advocate at the county to get as much as possible for folks so I don't think that's a discussion and a decision that we have had I think there are pluses and minuses to both approaches and I think there's a reason that every um table that is presented says these are not guaranteed these right right what how are they headed sorry I've got multiple tabs open right nothing's you know this is not guaranteed it's all contingent on on local funding like local and state funding so I appreciate the the tremendous amount of work that you all have done in a very short period of time um but I I and I trust that that what y'all were talking about when I stepped out is that the work that's going to come next is actual classified pay

guidelines and step placement guides that will give clarity to what is very very murky right now for folks looking at at all of this um so you know I I think it's a little bit of a of a I'm I'm struggling with the narrative that we haven't have published classified scales before because they are all on our website right I'm looking at them right now um the last time we did them the updates that we've had the 11% like all of that is out there and so what I don't want is anything that we vote tonight to take anybody backwards or to not be competitive with wake we were ahead of wake we've always been ahead of wake we can't always keep up with Chapel Hill but we try so as y'all continue to analyze what what the impact of this

very gray motion is I I know that that we will still try to maximize everything we can do to lead the state and so people that are above the Maxes we will use local money to continue to take them there we'll continue to work with with lifting up living wages we will continue to work with all any compression issues that we find but I appreciate any any Clarity that that we can bring sooner rather than later to to every single staff member and I think there's going to be a lot a lot of questions that come as soon as this payroll runs and we may need extra employees to be ready to to handhold people one by one by one at a time when we know we need more staff in HR and in finance and in payroll so whatever we can do to be ready for the questions that are that are forthcoming our our staff deserve it but thank you all Miss SP thank you for your discussion Miss Carter Aton

along those lines I just wanted to return to the um question that I know is difficult to answer but if you could give us like a rough estimate of when we should be when we should be looking to um discuss again the procedures and um around placement like are we thinking like in the um October work session maybe or like the first Mee in October the second Mee in October like what or are we thinking January just to give us an idea of when that could be possible based on what you know now can I say two things the first thing is she just said her contract goes till September 30th so I don't know um the terms of the contract Dr Lewis can you yeah we could again uh chat on tomorrow to see you know how much what what's the lift obviously and then what's the bandwidth and then what's the budget um but that's part of the salary Administration policy working group um that will be assembled to um assist in this work and um Vice shair

car I did hear you say that we'll have the experts um here and include members of classified or certified to help us with that as well as part of that that working group as well um and we'll work as quickly as possible uh to bring that back and I agree those pay guidelines that will be clear in terms of how we go about placing people on on schedules I wanted to respond to uh Miss spyer's comments about wanting to be ahead of wake um wanting to be uh the highest paid in the state and like being really aspirational aspirational about our desires my question I think is for colleagues is was that the expectation that we were getting that we had when we were getting this salary schedule or um

are we interested in staying within our budget yes um like right for sure we're not going to decide anything on you know on yes and I mean yeah okay I I just want to make sure that the board as a collective is making it clear what our desires are and um that we're all on the same page about that I just I would say yes we're the way I'm looking at it is um this is the part that's uncomfortable um we have to you know if we start in a place and that this is where the vulnerability comes in and we're we're being fiscally responsible and it ends up being something that

we're going to get a firestorm about at least it's transparent at least it's clear and then and then we can do the hard work to um with with proper meet and confer I'm just throwing that out there my and with proper community engagement and with the work of the board and the work of the staff collectively we can start doing things on in Greater capacity um to advocate for our fully for fully funding and what it's going to take to fully fund public schools and we can do it from a in in a sense I feel like a position of transparency sometimes you know it hurt but once you you know it's like it's just like anything once you clean something out something's always going to fill it so we don't know what that's I don't know I'm not going to speak for we I don't know what that's going to look like um when we make it that transparent that's what the vulnerability is but I would rather

operate from a place of transparency and um integrity and understanding and then build from there then to make promises to community that we can't keep and so in that you know from that lens I would support staying within our budget laying it out and then dealing with dealing with the Fallout I understand it I love our teachers and our Educators and our professionals um and I I want them and our and our students to have the best of the best um and I realize that this kind of transparency some people especially without understanding we may lose some folk if if we can't get it right you know because people have to look out for their best interest um so that is where the vulnerability comes in I'm I I don't want to be afraid of that I would rather see what it is um

and then start to make it better and let's hope that it's not that bad let's hope that it's much better than that that it won't be the worst case scenario but transparency Above All Else and fiscal responsibility moving forward thank you uh Mr tab yes just in um parliamentary procedure um can we stay truly Germain to um to the topic that we're on I've heard me didn't confer twice from this board that's coming up on the agenda later but I just want us to make sure we stay Germaine to what we're talking about because we are going to talk about that thank you okay all those in favor to approve the salary schedule with the minute Max new hires um at the minimum until we have further analysis please say I I I I all opposed say no it passes

60 um colleagues I could use a motion to approve the salary schedules that are current employees that have been model for our current employees I move that we honor the IND visualized emails that our employees received I'm looking at staff classified employees classified employees and re and does it does their email include the 3% raise or do we are we making that part of the motion as well I I suggest not framing it is the email but for our Legacy our existing classified employees will receive the pay quoted to them in um that includes the 11% the 3% State increase in any

reclassification they moved I'm sorry motions without seconds die I second removed by Miss Spire to prove classified pay schedule for legacy employees with the 11% from last year and additional 3% and seconded by Miss heral go and reclassification and it's been seconded by Miss heroff is there any further discussion just Clarity because I have heard I've gotten this inquiry what about the people that aren't listed on the salary tool the existing employees that aren't

listed can you share the answer to that um only certain people were included in that but there are people that will be addressed when and if the board approves the 3% raise from the state for other people like the list say coordinators and above that's the 3% and then you'll approve like the teacher scale and the teacher raises so the people that Miss o is speaking of is will be covered in a later motion that's what I was saying to her that you would not have to include those folks in the motion to approve the folks that were included in the salary projection tool which that included the 11% from last year plus any reclassification by Mr Crutchfield as well as the 3% State raise that's okay but um gel could you speak to that is that what that's on my list so I have directors and sorry go ahead I do recognize the class of employees that Dr

giovan is referring to as the coordinators and above but the salary tool was built on on a data set from earlier in the year so there were about 461 employees that were hired or moved positions between when that salary till was built so they're not in that group of employees they're actually classified employees that just changed within that time frame and were not included in the data set so those would need to receive their assignment because they just weren't on the they weren't present at the time that the data set was built so are they currently receiving the 11% yes they are but they wer included there are some actually there are some of them that are in the protection tool now there are a few employees as as the projection tool says it says if for some reason you don't have a line all you have to do is

contact HR every new hire has been hired under those same Provisions 11% from the salary they would have been assigned 2022 um 23 okay any reclassification um that came with the um position like if someone were a new employee and there were some re um classification that has been aligned as well as the 3% from the state there are a few that may not be in the salary projection tool that we are working to get them populated we have had additional individuals even populated since um the new one was uploaded as we are just vetting and making sure that they can get in correctly and so how is again how are they deter how how is it determined are they on the same there aren't schedules

for the um the what we just voted on basically but they're but how are they being a new employee now you would have to go to where you would set them in 2223 okay and then add the 11% and then you have the factors based on what um Mr Crutchfield has done we have some things that we have to do for nuances but there have been very limited of those as far as individuals reclassified but for new employees coming in your taking the 2022 23 salary schedule and adding the 11% Miss bu and can you can you clarify also that there are no employees in this group that we're about to make a motion on that would have made something higher on the tables and scales we just approved repeat that one more time I want to make sure I have full clarity I

think we there's no existing um employee that would make more money on the salary schedules just approved is that what you're asking that is my question is is there any case of any employee and if there was we would honor the higher amount correct I don't think there's a case that anyone would okay that's not possible I I think her question though is if there turn out to be one we would honor the higher amount that that is correct my question yeah that that I think that would be the expectation and what I believe has kind of been the philosophy of what is being shared that people will get depending on right the Legacy as long as it's higher whichever is higher between the new schedule and their legacy is that's what you're can I can my motion kind of can I add that to my motion so that we have Clarity if needed for any individual

that would find themselves at a higher place on this other or yall understood that and that's how y yeah I don't know even in current practice we would never default we are always going to default to the option that would be beneficial most beneficial to the employee if that is a viable option think Dr Lewis is it with your of feedback or to address what Miss oo is saying and we've all kind of talked through kind of there's some outliers and one-offs I think maybe after the board gets kind of through their motions perhaps Mr Malone can assist us with making sure that the board there's a global motion that for that authorizes finance and HR to ensure that employees that may not have gotten this letter or may not be on a payroll in this special

some kind of special way that they are Administration is authorized to ensure that those people are paid and approved by the board to get that to keep that 11% and that 3% raise something along those lines is what so we don't kind of spend I guess hours trying to what figure out what else yeah because there may be some that didn't get the reclassification yeah absolutely and I do think it's important just as we continue to work on communication there is no new letter that has gone out to employees right now if they go to the um schedules that are on the website on the classified one there is a link at the top of that schedule that will take them to the salary projection tool and so that is for some employees that may not understand where people are getting that link that is where the link is located

it's been moved by Miss Spire to approve the classified pay schedule of current employees with 11% 3% 11% from last year 3% for this year um and reclassification ensuring that employees get the benefit of the highest placement is there a second if the salary is not on the schedule second it's been seconded by Miss Chavez is there any further discussion all those in favor say I I I I it passes unanimously oh and yeah it passes

unanimously um how about supplements colleagues do we want to increase the supplements by $8 per month for teachers that we increase local supplements for teachers by $80 what I saw someone Flinch by $80 per month I'm trying to get these motions precise Miss price did I do something wrong no no I I just want to make sure because as we're building the schedules when we say teachers there's also local supplements for counselors and certifi staff does that do it no who is it who is it we want to be I just want to make sure we're clear so we can spe slps Etc go ahead the schedules as outlined it would be the certified and instructional

staff um speech language PES ideologist counselors I would also say on the one with teachers that in includes the nurses schedules those are the schedules that are PS um no OTS and PTs are not on a supplement on on a schedule that Garners a supplement those are the ones I I State at psychologist those should cover those um those pay schedules that would have that increase that anyone that is currently receiving a local supplement is getting an increase in a local if um we did not add um increases in supplement for administrators so remember you have a principal and assistant principal

schedule that would not be in so you want to be careful um with that piece those are the salary schedules that include supplements Miss B yeah I was trying to capture everyone I move that we approve an increase in an annual supplement of $800 or $80 a month on a 10-month employee for instructional staff speech language psychologist audiologists pts no nurses no what I'm gonna need someone else to to get the clarity that is needed here and I think that what we need is what was costed out right what was costed out would cover was cost out at 12 and a half

percent but it looks like what covered 2,900 employees so it wasn't hasn't been decided or conveyed which of those employees but based on the employees that received supplements last year if that increase to those existing supplements covers about 2,900 employees and the amount that is in the county ask of just over three million is correct so much appreciation Mr O um I don't feel comfortable giving Administration discretion to make that choice um colleagues can we take a five minute recess so they can figure out who these people are you need a motion okay I move that we recess for five minutes second it's been moved by Miss bu second Miss Chavez to take a 5 minute recess so Administration can figure out who's getting the local

supplements voted no all in favor say I I I I I all oppos say no we're in recess e

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e e thanks everybody for your patience thank you here Rogers I move that we approve an additional $80 a month stip

increase for speech language pathologist psychologist audiologist school counselors teachers nurses and instructional support Personnel second it's been moved by Miss supplement yes supplement I'm hearing for sure it's been moved by Miss buer seconded by Miss Chavez to uh approve an $8 per month increase in the supplement local supplement for speech language Pathologists psychologist ideologists school counselors teachers nurses instructional support personnel is there any further

discussion all those in favor say I I I all opposed say no it passes unanimously Miss price did we hit every question mark on your uh recommendation EC and ESL supplements can we get a brief clarification on who the EC supplements and ESL supplements will touch and how much they will be two sentence explanation your um the recommended $200 a month um

would touch regular um EC as well as the additional $50 differential for a specialized program teachers EC specialized program teachers the $200 month would also be all ESL teachers and then since you're saying e there's also the $200 per month EC classified and it's for the relevant classified sign language deaf and heart of hearing visually impaired and spoken language staff do you want those amounts again the projected amounts that were shared okay 200 per month for regular

E self-contained $200 per month EC classified differential for sign language DEA heart of hearing visually impaired and spoken language

6 million that was one of the things that Dr lusain said she felt that the vacancies were adequate to cover the amount but we have not costed out the

vacancy thank you for that Clarity Miss o we appreciate it and Dr G rning and everybody that brought that to our attention colleagues I'm I'm we also I think assured the county when we met with them that we would honor and make up any difference is this the amount that we said that we would find that's my memory um so I I think we need to do what we said we were going to do miss travez and when when would the vacancies be costed out provide a list of vacancies every week but I can work directly with Miss o Jo to get that um as soon as possible Miss caraon um thank you and I just want to

take a minute to acknowledge that this is like we want all the things for all our people and that this does not touch everybody body who works with our EC students um and maybe not our ESL students but I'm thinking EC in particular because I know that there are other categories that are not covered in this but this is what has been costed out for the most part um but I wonder if there's interest among other board members um in not for current but for for future for us to be able to see similar to the way that we requested tonight for Masters pay for us to see in the future when we're talking about supporting our EC staff and the recruitment retention needs in particular that our EC um departments have who else could be included in the future in a supplement like that neighboring districts supplement that we're not currently or that are other categories again that are not and if there's not an interest then that's fine just wanted to kind of raise

that um colleagues to miss Carter aon's point is there any interest in getting that information thumbs up so we'd like that information okay um so my question now my question to this motion is I let's say I'm an EC educator regular EC educator and I'm expecting a $200 per month supplement can I expect it to show up in my paycheck this month and so what we would seek to do after this meeting is number one from the IND individuals identified correspondents should go out to them to notify them like say for instance EC teachers need to know whether they're getting the 200 or the 350 and then from there the um information will be provided um to payroll and I cannot I cannot an answer for as far as a processing timeline but given that we

already have the list of individuals all of that information um should be able to to at least be sent to payroll in a um spreadsheet based on the research that has already been done on these individuals so now I'm just wondering whether with all that we're asking staff to do and work on this weekend to run payroll whether this piece which is significant but could be retr paid back to folks might hold and and I just I'm I'm trying to actually just look at the ex exhaustion level of our staff and whether there is complete readiness for this piece and any feedback you have Dr leis do this will this additional supplement I'm looking at bro will this additional supplement impact retirement as well is it's part of their

in terms of the past the 90day please speak into the mic so as I understand it and um your fin it's officer can maybe better explain this but as I understand it um the if you retroactive it retro make it retroactive back to July next month the the money that's this particular portion of it in July would not appear as part of their salary in the retirement system they get the money obviously but it wouldn't show up the 200 or 350 would not show up in

their salary that that that gets reported for retirement purposes that right so and we're still investigating um the form 466 there is a form that can be filled out for each employee to try to have funds recognized that are older than 90 days but we're not sure what the interest has to be paid or how that will truly affect their retirement earnings so we've got to call out to um the retirement system to verify it um it was not advised that we explor that option but to know the full implementations and what the interest charge would be and our payroll supervisor is also not sure if we can pay it on behalf of the employee or if the employee has to file that so but it would it would be that two or 350 for that one single month um again they would still get the cash they just would not get the retirement contribution for that one month

I certainly wouldn't want to impact anyone's retirement in any way whatsoever we can work to make this happen we're going to have to work to make this happen yes there's a motion on the floor we're in discussion thank you Dr Lewis for acknowledging that we're going to work to make this happen in September right okay I'll keep my commentary to myself um colleagues um all those in favor hi hi I I hi I'll opposed say no it passes

unanimously Miss price anything else want to make sure thank you for the passing and the clarity around the salary schedules everything that has been passed we will note on the respective schedule so people will see that and then the supplements will increase so that the $80 is added and so they can so everyone can see their their salary there as well for the supplements um the EC and the SL Etc will be a footer that is added um because it is across many different places and we don't know who those employees are so I just want to make sure that's clear thank you and we want to make sure we approve Master's pay Nicole has have we made a motion on the Master's B yeah my understanding was that that

was work that was going to be done to see a list is there a motion to approve we're also doing classroom teachers this time yes and sorry thank you no yes and we're doing um classroom teachers and then a list for next budget which we already approved and requested uh Dr Len yes um chair Rogers just as um the board is framing their desires regarding Master's pay for classroom teachers we um would like Guidance Do you want to align to DPI guidelines or not that would be the question keeping in mind that right now um B on that list that I gave you it was what 237 that just flat out have Masters and so alignment to DPI would be a question that we would have just to be able to

finalize the list because it would be a difference Dr Lin when you sent out the survey what did you ask people to do we asked people to let us know if they had a master's um we were looking for the people who were not already being paid on their masters and they had to upload um their relevant documentation including their transcript for evaluation of that and based on that evaluation you would have certain people who would get paid if you're aligned to DPI practices but if it is not DM's desire to align directly to DPI practices Administration just needs that information so that we can assure all qualifying individuals are paid so when you asked Educators to respond to the Google form did you tell them that whether or not it would be aign to DPI standard or did you just ask

them to fill out a form we have talked we have used the language relevant Masters which is based on DPI um practices but um to explicitly just like the same communication around who's included as a classroom based teachers I think that that communication is probably not interpreted the Same by every employee and if we add the stipulation now are we excluding some Educators that have previously been included in the number that would be that 189 that I was sharing with you includes the DPI stipulations to the best of our judgment I would move that we approve a 10% PID differential for Relevant Master's Degree for classroom based teachers aligned to ncdpi

guidelin Second salary that is what the Master's 10% is the Master's differential it's been moved by um Miss buer secondary by Miss Chavez to have Administration appli 10% incre uh supplement to um differential pay differential um to classroom teachers that have a relevant master's degree along the aligned with ncdpi guidelines and standards is there any discussion I know Miss Bryce did note that that will that's not modeled in the salary schedules and because it is aligned to

individuals that we would not be modeling that in the schedules because a differential is based on indiv individuals and so I just want to be clear around that as the board is making this decision um and so that people aren't going to be looking for that in the schedule and that is something that would be applied in in their paycheck based on their assignment Etc Miss Carter Aton um Dr L I know that you described this earlier I just want to make sure we're all really clear on the what the DPI guidelines say so I have this is all about the relevancy there's you said there's two levels for the subject matter is one what's on your licensees the other is this can you help me just make sure we're all clear on the people that would be excluded what is it that's excluding them out of those two and so what we would really have to do for this is anyone excluded we would have to communicate with them the reason for their exclusion keep in mind we have we

had to look at each individual um submission because you have to look at what is on their what is already existing on their license you have to consider the program they went through and you have to consider the relevancy to the area that they are currently teaching so the reason for exclusion that would be named would be one of those things it would be related to one of those areas colleagues I submit for y'all to consider the form says in order for our lenser department to determine if you meet the Master's pay criteria please upload the f in information your current teaching license indicating your master's degree area or in capital bow letters your master's degree transcript with your conferred date correct okay it doesn't say the standard that you're asking about it being marked on their

license that isign with DPI say that again didn't you say it has in the ncdpi rules that it has to be marked on their license that they're in that relevant no that is no it's the relationship you have to look at their current we have access to anyone that has an existing license right we have access to that in the system so you have to consider the area that is already on their license okay you have to look at what they're teaching okay so I'm not sure I'm understanding the question so we asked them for information that we would not have access to in the survey for them to provide it for us for us to be able to do that

evaluation and the confusion is that asked for either like it said or it didn't say on there that they had to upload the license if they wanted to receive that's that's it and so if they already have the Masters on their license then we already have access so you have people thank you for that you have employees that have ma their masters displayed on their license but that doesn't mean they're compensated for it so that means their evaluation materials are already there but nine times out of 10 those are individuals that did not meet the June the the um 2013 rule but they have been evaluated by DPA DPI already and the Masters is reflected on their license so you do have license that you can pull up you can see Masters but that individual is not compensated on their

masters by the state okay it's been moved by missp and seconded by Miss Chavez to um approve the 10% Master's differential for classroom teachers based on ncdpi standards all those in favor say I I I I I all oppos say no it passes unanimously Al Le I believe we have um Mr Malone do you want us to do this over this motion okay while we're checking Dr Lewis yeah just had some thank the board for their engagement uh this evening and definely

thank um uh Miss price uh for your work uh and the team that has been working all week um definitely want to honor Micah TW tweet Meer for coming out spending an hour with us today looking at these um schedules definitely appreciate your partnership I think it was Edward Demming that's credited for um the statement every system is designed to get the results that it's getting uh and I think tonight as I spoke to earlier there's um evidence of some systems work that that that needs to be done and so we have a lot of work to do but I am confident that we will we will get there to say that thank you thank you Miss Carter Aton make another motion um

this is um a motion to authorize Administration to place any existing employees that are not covered by a previous schedule approved tonight to be placed on the most employee favorable schedule for the 2425 school year okay moved by Miss Carda-Auten second day by Miss sper to authorize the administration to place any existing employee that are not covered by the previous schedule approved tonight to be placed on the most employee favorable schedule for the 2024 25 school year is there any discussion all those in favor say I I I it passes unanimously with that we're we have a hearing so I didn't know when how we were going to deal with that to if I so procedurally you would adjourn this

meeting and then you would reconvene the panel meeting from 4:30 Yep this meeting is a separate meeting you would adj adjourn this and then you'll reconvene that and then you'll get a motion to go into close session for personnel matters with that we are adjourned thank you good night everybody