City Council · Regular Meeting · January 20, 2026

>> Good evening everyone. Welcome to city hall. It's great to see everyone here and to have you all who are listening in online. Great to have you with us.

This meeting is called to order at 700 pm and I'll ask that you join me in a moment moment of silence. >> Thank you. I'll pass it over to council member Wrist for the pledge of allegiance. >> Good evening.

If it is your practice, I invite you to rise and recite this pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

>> Thank you. All right, madam clerk, will you please call the role? >> Good evening. Mayor Williams >> here.

>> Mayor Prom Cabayo >> here. >> Council member Baker >> here. >> Council member Burrus >> present. >> Council member Cook >> here.

>> Council member Copac >> here. >> And council member Ris >> here. >> Thank you. At this time we will proceed into our ceremonial items.

And usually at this time we have uh proclamations read. Tonight is a little different. We have a proclamation, but we also are going to have a unique oath of office for a Durham resident who's been appointed by Governor Josh Stein to the uh to the North Carolina Symphony Society Incorporated Board of Trustees. So, Miss Brown, Dr. Brown, would you please join me? And if you have any guests with you,

okay, you can join me right down here in front. Lift up your

All right. Before I proceed into the readings of the uh you can rest your hand. I'm gonna brag on you for a moment. Uh I just wanted to take a moment to uh let you know as mayor I'm extremely proud to have a dorm representative uh on this uh being administered to sworn into this board of trustees.

As a classical tubist myself and a former co-board member with you with the Durham Symphony uh it is uh is a great pleasure. I uh Dr. Brown, I've seen your work over the years. I appreciate your commitment.

Uh most people know you probably through your affiliation with the arts. However, uh you have a very decorated uh list of credentials and your research and and all the other work that you do from RTI and and all the sorts. Uh so this is a great honor and you make Durham look really good. So just wanted to brag on you for a moment. All right.

So, at this time, I'll get to administer your oath. It's exciting. So, I'll um state this and uh have you state your name. I state your name.

>> Brown. >> Do solemnly. And you'll repeat after me, of course. do solemnly swear >> do solemnly swear >> that I will support the Constitution of the United States >> that I will support the Constitution of the United States >> and I state your name. I'm Dorothy Brown. do solemnly swear >> solemnly swear >> that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance >> that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance >> to the state of North Carolina >> to the state of North Carolina >> and to the constitutional powers >> and to the constitutional powers >> and authorities which are >> and to the authorities which are >> or may be >> or may be >> established lished for the government

thereof. >> that may be established for the government thereof. >> And that I will endeavor to support >> And I will endeavor to support >> maintain >> maintain >> and defend the Constitution >> and defend the Constitution >> of said state >> of North Carolina. >> Not inconsistent with >> not inconsistent with >> the Constitution of the United States.

not inconsistent with the Constitution of the United States. >> And I state your name. >> I, Dorothy C. Brown, >> do solemnly swear >> do solemnly swear >> that I will well >> that I will well >> and truly execute >> and truly execute >> the duties of my office >> the duties of my office >> as a member of >> as a member of >> the North Carolina Symphony Society Incorporated Board of Trustees. North Carolina Symphony Society Incorporated, the board of

trustees. >> According to the best >> according to the best >> of my skill and ability >> my skill and ability >> according to the law >> according to the law. >> So help me God. >> So help me God.

>> Congratulations. >> Congratulations. [laughter] [applause] Yeah. No, I was saying and that's a lot for the North Carolina Symphony and I'm very proud to serve on that board.

I don't know how many of you know about the symphony, but I think it's very important to have representation from Durham because we have a Durham symphony and I'm going to encourage them to work closely with our symphony. >> Thank you. [applause]

All right, we uh have our next presentation will be a proclamation. >> And if I may ask Mr. Mayor to just give us a couple minutes. >> Yep.

>> Um uh I think another one of our recipients uh is just going to get situated. So, if we could be patient for one more, I would appreciate. >> We're gonna go ahead into uh we we're going to go into announcements and then we'll come back to the final proclamation. All right.

Council member Baker, why don't you get us started? >> Good evening, everyone. Thank you uh for being here on this uh chilly evening. Uh just want to say thank you to um Chief Zaldos and uh several many of our firefighters at station one uh for giving me a tour um last week. Uh it was very informative and our emergency services workers are are critical to the

functioning of our city and they work hard every day and they show up in really tough positions and and oftent times on the worst day of some of our residents of the worst day of their lives. So, um, thank you to to them. Um, also, happy Martin Luther King Jr. Day.

Um, such an important day. Um, I was able to march from North Carolina Mutual to First Presbyterian Church uh, yesterday and, uh, there were many beautiful messages. I was particularly moved by, uh, many in the labor movement who showed up to lift up uh, Dr. King's analysis of the three evils of American society, which uh in his view were poverty, racism, and militarism. Three evils that are front and center and in our faces every single day here in the US under our federal fascist government. Um, and on the one hand, things are are worse on many fronts than they have been

ever or or in a very long time. And on the other hand, um these evils have been present with us all along but hidden behind politeness uh for a very long time. And um over the past four decades, for example, the gap, the wealth gap between black families and white families has not gotten better, has not stayed the same, but has actually gotten worse. Um when Dr.

King uh at the time of his assassination he had uh 33% favorability and 63% unfavorability. He was hated. He was uh people were uncomfortable with him. Today he has a 94% approval or favorability rating.

Only 4% of uh the population are un are unfavorable see him as as unfavorable. Um, and that is through years and decades of of frankly culture war to to lift him up and and his message. But he

was a radical and he criticized capitalism and the Vietnam War which made even his own allies at times uncomfortable. And I think that we have a lot of work to do to carry forward Dr. King's uh legacy uh his uh work on civil rights, his work on economic justice. Um but also I think that we need to look to present day examples of people amongst us who fight every day for humanity but while doing so might make us feel uncomfortable.

Um and then lastly, I just want to say that uh it's very cold today. It's cold all week. We also have inclement weather that appears to be coming our way. Uh and so I do want to make sure on our side that we are um sheltering our unhoused uh neighbors. Um providing ample communication to our residents uh

about uh any potential uh service impacts that the weather might have. And I want to say thank you to our city workers today and every day for always being there and showing up at difficult times. Thank you. >> Thank you, Council Member Cook.

>> Are we skipping? Nope. Okay. All right.

We're just going in a weird order. Okay. Um, good evening everyone. Thank you for being here.

Uh, I'm just going to read a short part of um the letter from Birmingham jail. But more basically, I am in Birmingham because injustice is here. Just as the prophets of the 8th century BC left their villages and carried their thus sail, sayaith the Lord, far beyond the boundaries of their hometowns, and just as the Apostle Paul left his village of Taurus and carried the gospel of Jesus Christ to the far corners of the Greco Roman world, so am I compelled to carry

the gospel of freedom beyond my hometown. Like Paul, I must constantly respond to the Macedonian call for aid. Moreover, I am cognizant of the interrelatedness of all communities and states. I cannot sit idly by in Atlanta and not be concerned about what happens in Birmingham.

Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality tied in a single garment of destiny. We hear a lot about Martin Luther King on this weekend and other times. I want to lift a voice out today to [sighs] speak about injustices that we're facing um both members of our community and also just because liberation is tied together and so when some are suffering all are suffering. Um I want to again give support to the folks in Minneapolis and say that we are behind you. We do not condone the federal government attacking citizens and criminalizing

protected behavior um and murdering people in broad daylight. And that is not just us to Renee Good, although my heart goes out to her and her family um but to all of the folks who've been killed in ICE custody over the last year. Um, I also want to recognize that we have seen 12,000 or probably more people murdered in Iran for protesting a fascist government. Um, we have again people who are directly impacted by this in our community. Um but it impacts all of us because this is a regime that has been held up um by uh US aid and we need to be cognizant of how our actions in the Middle East um track actions in South America and other places and how our colonialist history and militarism um is is killing innocent people and and

keeping folks oppressed. Um, and all of that is linked to the decisions that we make here as well. And want to recognize that when we talk about gentrification and displacement that these two are governmental um harms that we are conducting on our own people. And so we really need to be cognizant about how all these things are interrelated.

Um, I too was at the march with several of my colleagues and was really grateful for the organizers and especially folks who are doing the work organizing labor movements across this city and across this state. Um, my support for all of those efforts and I'm here to do what I can to give voice to those folks and also support policy where I'm able. So, thank you all for being here and I look forward to a good meeting. >> Thank you for those remarks. Uh, Council Member Kobec.

>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh, good evening everyone. A pleasure to have all of you with us here this evening.

Uh, and I want to say what a privilege it is in just a few moments to be able to read a proclamation um in recognition of the 25th anniversary of the anti- sweat shop ordinance. It is still human trafficking month. Uh, and so it's very appropriate that we will be doing that shortly. Uh we can all think back to where we were 25 years ago.

Uh you know for me it was engaging in anti- sweat shop uh campus advocacy and then serving as a Peacecore volunteer in West Africa where children in my community were um either kidnapped or out of desperation uh sometimes uh sent uh to work in fields um and manufacturing facilities um in in another country away from their home. And um and I I still recall um being with members of my community um when a truck was stopped um uh carrying children away from their homes and seeing the fear in their faces as we brought them back to their families. And so this is definitely personal and it

ties into the economic justice themes uh of of of this time uh with uh Martin Luther King Jr. holiday. And so I want to thank the folks we'll be awarding and uh proclaiming this evening uh and for everyone else who takes action on on work around uh human trafficking and economic justice in our community and beyond. Um I appreciated uh the opportunity this weekend uh to join in worship in community service in fellowship in multiple events uh across Durham.

It was a great opportunity to come together uh and have speakers and and activists uh reflect on the evils of racism, materialism, and militarism which are ever present today and who called on us to live out the legacy of Dr. King and the civil rights movement year round today. Um highlights for me were also the march. It was great to be there with members of my colleagues uh from NC Mutual to First Presbyterian and also joining students at NCCU uh for service activities where we packed out diapers for diaper bank and uh meals for rise against hunger. It was a really

great celebratory and and really purposeful um day. Um so thanks to everyone who hosted this weekend um to bring folks together uh to help really call on us to continue the work uh for justice. So thank you. >> Thank you, Council Member Wrist.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Good evening, colleagues, Mr. City Manager, staff, residents, all here in the room and on those online.

Good to see you all. Um, yeah, it was a wonderful MLK day yesterday. Great to see somebody out there on a beautiful yet cold day. Um, I as well join many of my colleagues on the march from the mutual building down to First Presbyterian.

You know, this is a march I've done, my gosh, probably like 30 years since my kids were little. So, it's, you know, every every King Day like 10:30 we gather at the mutual building. Um, I want to give a shout out to Warren Hearnden, Reverend Warren Hearnden, uh, Re Reverend Pebbles Lindsay Lindseay Lucas and the rest of the steering committee for once again organizing the march and the rally afterwards and and the service. Also proud to be at First Pres for that service. It's my home church and so it's always a great sort of annual event

there. Thanks to Reverend Mindy Douglas and Reverend Esther Hethox for being there to host folks at the church. So great service um, and great to be there and great to see some of you all there as well. Um there were so many things going on yesterday.

Also there was um Book Harvest, a great organization Durham, you all know provides books for kids promoting early literacy. They had their annual dream big book drive at the at the um uh oh Box Boxyard out in RTP. Great spot there for that. Tons of volunteers that came out to help Book Harvest.

Can't thank Book Harvest enough for the work they do, for the expansion they're engaged in around the state. It's a great model to promote early literacy. So Alison support Book Harvest as you as as much as you can. Um, the last thing I'll say is there was a great uh great event last night. Also, a couple colleagues were there, including the the city attorney was there at the Carolina Theater to watch the premiere of a movie called Breaking the Booth, which is a story of youth protesters in Durham back in the late 50s, who organized and essentially pressured the Carolina Theater, which was the last

segregated building or less segregated business in Durham, owned by the city of Durham, pressured them into into integrating. This is a great story. Many people who still are in our community were part of those youth who were back then young people engaged in that struggle. They're still alive, which is great.

And many of them were in the movie. So, it's great to have those stories still told. It's great to have the documentary there that we have while those folks are still alive. An amazing story of an early civil rights struggle that informed much of the later civil rights movement with the protest and using youth trained in churches.

So, great story for Durham. Something we can all be proud of. Go see the documentary if you have a chance. It's called breaking.

Let me get it right here. Oops. Yeah, it's called breaking the booth. Um, and then the last thing on a more somber note, I want to echo the colleague the comments of my colleague, Council Member Cook. Um, it is really concerning whenever federal troops are in on standby to move in and invade an American city. And so anyone in America, wherever you live, should be concerned

if there are federal troops anywhere prepared to move into an American city to resist folks who are expressing their own constitutional rights to protest their government. So we're concerned. Our hearts go out to our friends and folks in in the Twin Cities who must be feeling a lot of a lot of anxiety. And so uh we are our hearts are with them.

Thank you all. >> Thank you, Council Member Bur. >> Good evening. Happy Tuesday to everyone.

Thank you all for joining us for our city council meetings. So, I'm going to start off a little bit in the inverse and start some birthday shouts out. We'll shout out to a couple organizations. So, I want to wish a happy founder day to the women of Delta Sigma Theta Sority Incorporated as well as Zeta 5 beta um sorority incorporated, but also to the magnificent women of Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority Incorporated, which I'm a member of.

Also, we celebrated our founders day last week, 118 years of service. So, I'm greatly appreciative for the opportunity. Um by the time you get to the end, I'm going to repeat what a lot of folks have already said. So, I did have an opportunity to attend the rally yesterday.

I did not march. So I commend my colleagues for going out in the cold weather. That was not my ministry

yesterday morning. So I appreciate you all for bearing the elements of going out for me that I did join you all later. Um there was a lot of great speakers, a lot of great calls to action during that event. But I was especially moved by Dr.

Will Guzman from NCCU, my alma mada who's a assistant profession professor for international programs and community engagement. Um, I also thought about the letter from Birmingham jail and so when I discussed it earlier and it's a very powerful and rich text, but I thought about the role of the white moderate and Dr. King uplifting the role of white moderate and how what it does for justice. And so I just want to think as we quote things from Dr.

King, just think about the world we in and how do we show or display his actions that a little better because I haven't quite seen that in Durham. And so if we're going to address all the things that going on across the country, we have to start here at home by having more compassion for our neighbors by being present in our community and making sure that we're just not being performative. So I'm I'm not accusing anyone of doing that, but I think that when I reread the

letter from Birmingham jail, the piece around the white moderate and the clergy members is what really really stood out for me in terms of how our justice has not come. and Martin Luther King was assassinated in 1968, the same year my mother was born. And we have regressed in our society. So elections have consequences.

We start early voting next month, February 12th, I believe. So I would encourage you all to do your own research and make sure you vote for well-qualified candidates. Um we cannot have a repeat and this is our time to make sure that we still maintain our democracy. So I want to upload that for everyone as well.

Also had opportunity to attend the 15th annual um dream big book drive, a community collaboration hosted by book harvest yesterday at Box um yard. I got there just in time to hear our current congressional U. Representative Valerie Fushi speak, delivering a very powerful message as well as always. And then also just looking forward to having a very productive meeting.

Hopefully we'll go home before the sun comes up. So I look forward to engaging everyone at night. Thank you.

[laughter] >> I feel like jinxing. Mayor Prom. >> Thank you. [clears throat] Good evening everyone.

Good to be here with y'all. Uh thank you to all my colleagues for their excellent comments. Um uh it's always good to be out in community. I was able to I was out of town most of the weekend but was able to hit up a few events yesterday and I will say that the the film at Carolina Theater was uh incredible and I hope um other Durham residents are able to see it.

It was a packed house and so um uh it is the 100th anniversary year of the Carolina Theater and so they will be having events throughout the year and so I hope folks take advantage of it because they have pretty incredible programming planned. Um that is all. Oh uh quickly this is for residents. Uh budget season has officially kicked off in the city of Durham uh between now and our second meeting in June. We will be working diligently on the budget when we pass it. [clears throat and cough] uh our council uh budget items that we want uh to see or were um our due date

was last Friday. Uh we will have two budget retreats in February, February 13th and February 20th, I believe. Uh those budget retreats will be streamed and they are also open to the public uh if you decide to attend in person. Um the city has won awards for how open and transparent our budget process is.

So I encourage all residents to pay attention. Um that's the very beginning of the process. Uh and it's uh always the busiest time for both city staff and council as we get to to June. So I'm going to preemptively thank all of our city staff who got probably lots of things on on Friday uh from council members with lots of our our big dreams.

>> The dates. >> I know it's February 13th. >> 13th and 27th. >> 27th.

Thank you. February 13th and 27th. >> All right. Thank you colleagues for your remarks. Um uh yesterday was quite the day. I want to thank the Triangle uh MLK

m. 7:15. Gosh. Um it was a long day.

Uh so kudos to them. was a great turnout. Thanks to WRL for of course again um airing it and to the Capital Broadcasting Group for um sponsoring it. Uh also shout out to um the Duke School uh for hosting the uh the community uh the Rotary event uh where the community comes together and pack meals.

Of course, our city attorney was quite busy yesterday because she was also there again this year every year. And the goal was 55,000 mills um a day of service and and meeting that mark is always quite the celebratory moment. Uh kudos to uh Reverend H. Hearnden.

Um I could not march. I appreciate you all for marching. I did have to leave. Thank

you, Council Member Ris for stepping in. And um I shared remarks at the beginning of the march, but I had to depart. Um but thank you all for being there and and and representing the city. um left there.

I was able to go home yesterday to my home county and and was their keynote speaker for the MLK program and um and and left and came back to Durham uh from Halifax County and went to the the Durham um Martin Luther King Steering Committee event which was also very well attended. Thanks to Orange Grove Baptist Church for hosting it. Uh and my message yesterday uh was actually quite similar to some of the remarks up here. Um we talk about history and we have a lot of quotes that we project uh from Dr.

L Dr. um Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Uh but there's a difference in his story and

history. His story was an architectural layout and we can choose to repeat it or we can choose to learn from it. But we do have to do more than just quote it. And we have to we do have to understand that we we we have some of the same fights, but we have new fights as well.

And if I'm being very frank, as I was all there yesterday, it's really hard to fight the evils of this federal government when we're constantly fighting at the local level as well. So, I hope that one thing we do learn is what community really means. It means we're not always going to agree. We're not always going to be on the same page, but we can reach higher when we're lifting one another up rather than tearing one another down. And there are people that we are constantly speaking over as if we're the clouds. Meanwhile, they are struggling

on a daily basis and we project subliminals and messages while we forget about those people. So, we have a lot of work to do and I hope that we don't keep overlooking that. Um, and yes, I I don't think we can reference this enough. Um, I I'm getting all of the inbox messages, mayor, why don't you arrest ICE?

You know, I'm getting all the inbox messages of, you know, uh, get your city attorney to sue, you know, sue Trump. Um, and I'm talking to mayors across the country, you know. So, I I something that we're working on right now is just, you know, we are a fourth amendment city. uh we stepped up and did that before all the other cities did. proud of that and I am requesting that we expand on that to make sure that we have a website where you know your rights and so we're just making sure that we

can have that available and whether it's going to be you know I don't know if it's going to be on the city website just yet we're kind of looking at that looking at the legalities of it uh we are careful not to make the targets on the backs of our most vulnerable community bigger but at the same time we want to make sure the information is available to So, uh, we're just kind of swimming through those channels to see what that looks like. And, um, but what I can say is yes, there are American communities under attack by American resources and that is problematic and it's not okay. People are dying at the hands that are supposed to protect them. We've seen this story before and one thing we can say about this story that we've read before is we've beat it before.

So, as my colleague said, November is coming, but March will be here first. Go vote. All right,

let's get to the proclamation. And Council Member uh Kobach, if you will, um uh use this podium over here to your to the uh presenting podium. Thank you for being here. >> Good evening.

Um before I begin, I'm just going to hold up this lovely photo of the organizers, activists who came together 25 years ago to fight for this anti- sweat shop ordinance. Uh really a leader not just in Durham, but in cities across the country. Uh and so such a lovely photo and um you know pleasure to have this commemorate the event and and have uh it uh go home with you uh to grace wherever you like it grace. >> Um yes uh and I want to thank Miss Harkrader and Miss Elamine who travel from Georgia if I have that correct to be here.

>> Columbus, Georgia. >> From Columbus, Georgia. Thank you ma'am for traveling this way to be here with us this evening. Uh and so proclamation

whereas Durham is a city that believes in the dignity and worth of each individual regardless of color or creed and whereas the Durham City Council and mayor 25 years ago unanimously passed she you want to come up here with me? Thank you. Want to come over here? Love to have you up here.

Thank you. Um whereas the Durham City Council and Mayor 25 years ago unanimously passed the Durham anti- sweat shop procurement ordinance which prohibits purchase by the city of Durham of items made in sweat shops anywhere in the world. And whereas the NC legislature passed a bill sponsored by North Carolina Senator Paul Lubkkey allowing municipalities to not purchase items made in sweat shops despite those items being the lowest cost available. Now therefore, I, Leonardo Williams, Mayor of Durham, North Carolina, do hereby proclaim January 20th, 2026 as anti-swat shop procurement ordinance day in the city of Durham, and hereby urge

residents to take note of this observance. Witness my hand in the corporate seal of the city of Durham, North Carolina, this 20th day of January, 2026. Leonardo Williams, Mayor. [applause] Well, thank you so much, Mr.

Mayor, for the proclamation. I live in Columbus, Georgia, and I've been singing the praises of Durham for 15 years. And people should note uh that when the ordinance was passed 25 years ago, many calls came in from around the country uh because the actual ordinance reads like a pyic against child labor. And we must thank Jeannie Lucas and Paul Luki because the state of North Carolina

requires that you take the lowest bidder. And Jeannie Lucas said in the Senate when she was fighting for Durham to have the right to not buy sweat goods. She said people were shaking their Bibles at each other. And she said the vote went down 47 to one.

" Because Durham is an international city. And the only other time Durham had requested an exception was in 1980 when Durham said it would not do business with South Africa for the purpose of ending a part. So we're in good company. anti sweat no aparte and it was a proud moment that night and you can see from the picture which I will give to Lana cuz I do have the original and Lana owns the picture now but it was a great

night. It was a great night 11 to zero. Thank you. I'm so happy to be here.

Thank you. >> Well, we're glad you're here. [applause] Thank you for coming. Thank you so much, council member.

I'll come and join you for a picture. Oh, the mayor's coming. Oh, great. This is going to be great.

I'm going to show it at the city council next Tuesday in Columbus City Council meets and I'll be telling all about this. >> Tell my good buddy Mayor say hello. >> Oh, you know Skip. >> I'll be sure to tell her.

Oh, thank you. >> Which where we looking? >> Where are we looking?

Thanks. >> Oh, good. And I appreciate being on the list. Y'all doing great things.

I love that. Oh, I love what you're doing, Mr. Mayor. 4 for me and giving people a choice to vote on.

I'm still on the list. You treat me like I still live and I really appreciate [applause] If you ever question what Bull City Pride was, now you know. All right.

Now, u pass it over to Mr. Manager for your priority items. Thank you, Mayor, Madame Mayor Prom, [snorts] members of council. The city manager's office just has a few priority items this evening.

First, for agenda items number 12 and 19, there was additional information requested from council at the work session that has been provided in your packet. And for agenda item number 14, that's the interlocal agreement reauthorizing the Durham bicycle and pedestrian advisory committee. Uh there was a request to modify language in the uh in the document and that modification has been made. So, those are the priority items this evening.

Other than I did want to announce briefly and thank Council Member Baker for previewing the uh this weekend's uh potential winter storm. We'll be tracking that this week and we'll have some brief updates at the beginning of Thursday's council work session just to let you know our preparations for that. Thank you. >> And thank you for the additional beds for the resources that we have available now.

>> Thank you. Yes. Uh by my uh kudos to the

community safety staff who've been working throughout the day uh in advance of this winter weather. Uh I heard some excellent recommendations today to help maximize available resources, working with all of our partners throughout Durham to make sure that uh unhoused individuals in Durham have safe shelter options going into the storm and always. My kudos to that to them and thank you council member Baker again for raising that issue as well. >> Madam Attorney, >> good evening Mr.

Mayor, Madame Mayor Prom, and members of the council. It's good to be with you. The city attorney's office has no priority items this evening. >> Thank you, Madam Clerk.

>> Good evening, Mr. Mayor, Madame Mayor Pertim, and members of council. The city clerk's office has one priority item. That's item three, affordable housing implementation committee appointment, and this item was referred back to staff um during the last city council work session.

>> All right. Thank you. At this time, I'll read the consent agenda. Item number one, just give me

one moment. All right. Just remind me. >> All right.

Thank you. [clears throat] All right. Items number um consent agenda. Item number one, mayor Hispanic Latino committee appointment.

Item number two, participatory budgeting steering committee appointment. Number three, affordable housing implementation committee has been referred back to staff. Um, item number four has been pulled by the public. Uh, interlocal agreement with Durham Technical Community College for street and right-of-way upgrades.

Item number five, US Department of Housing and Urban Development, HUD, Continuum of Care, CLC, Planning Grant Grant Project Ordinance. Number six, contract for third party administration of workers compensation liability claims. Number seven, cooperative group

purchase contract has been pulled by the public. Uh, number eight, cooperative group purchase contract full-size rear loaders. Number nine, cooperative group purchase contract police vehicles. Number 10, fire and emergency medical services station 19 project guaranteed maximum price [clears throat] amendment to the construction manager at risk contract.

Number 11, HUD grant project resolution GPR for CPF and grant project ordinance GO amendments for home and CDG CDBG. Number 12, first amendment to ARPA coronavirus state local fiscal recovery funds subawward agreement between city of Durham and Hay Promise Community Development Corporation St. Joseph's Historic Foundation Incorporated has been pulled by the public. Number 13, amendment to contract number 20910 with Hay Promise CDC St. Joseph's and number

21481 for Hai Street corridor. Hey, for Fedville Street corridor neighborhood stabilization partnership implementation has also been pulled by the public. Number 14, interlocal agreement reauthorizing the drone bicycle and pedestrian advisory commission has been pulled by the public. Number 15, second amendment to supplemental agreement number three to m to the master agreement number 18928 for design of downtown Durham bike lanes tip BL000028 with me and Hunt Incorporated.

Number 16, Durham County Open Space Davis Conservation Easement Watershed Project authorization to fund. Number 17, contract amendment number one to the professional engineering services contract with CDM Smith Incorporated for the high-pressure zone improvements phase one project contract number 17539. Number 18, contract amendment number two

to the professional engineering services contract with CDM Smith Incorporated for the sewer system evaluation survey services project contract number 15785. Number 20, uh, which is a a, um, public hearing, consolidated annexation, Britmore. Number 21, zoning map change, Andrew's Chapel Apartments. And number 22, consolidated annexation Trenton Road assemblage.

Make sure 21. Okay, that's public hearing. Yep. All right.

total. >> All right, that is our consent agenda with uh items 4, 7, 12, 13, 14 being pulled. Um entertain a motion to uh approve the consent agenda with without pulled items. >> So move second. >> It's been moved and properly seconded.

Clerk, please open the vote. One more. There we go. Please close the vote.

>> And the motion passes unanimously. >> Thank you. All right, starting from the top, Mrs. Victoria Peterson.

Victoria Peterson. Okay. All right. All right. We will uh I don't have the speaker here who pulled that. So, uh, council, I'll entertain a motion to resolve that the city manager be authorized to enter into an agreement with Durm Tech, Durm Technical Community College to provide funding in the amount not to exceed $2 million, enabling Durm Techch, Durm Technical Community College to execute physical improvements to the 1600 block of Lawson Street, East and West, between Bacon and South Briggs

Avenue and other right-of-way improvements in association with the construction of a new health sciences voting on the Durham Technical Community College campus. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Move and properly seconded.

Madam clerk, please open the vote. Please close the vote. >> And the motion passes unanimously. >> Awesome.

Looking forward to those updates. The next item was number seven, cooperative group purchase contract patrol vehicle upfitting. This is uh pulled by the public. Uh, Lindsay, is there a Lindsay?

Oh, there we go. Welcome. You have three minutes. >> Take your time, but you you have three minutes when you start.

>> Hello. >> Welcome. >> Uh, my name is Lindsay. I am speaking in opposition to agenda item number seven.

Uh this purchase is just another example of public safety spending that does nothing to target the actual root causes of crime. 6 million in police vehicle spending that frankly I find difficult to believe is necessary. Installing camera and computer mounts should be bottom priority for spending when we have people hungry and freezing standing outside this building right now being served food out of our pockets, paid for out of our pockets. And much like the paragrin and insight LPR contracts associated with the real-time crime center, the spending on these vehicles foretells future unnecessary spending on the laptops, the software on these laptops, the cameras, the motion detection systems that will further contribute to unconstitutional surveillance in this city. Last year, we saw an expansion of an already multi-million dollar contract with Axon Enterprises for additional

data storage for Durham Police Department, especially body cam footage. Then, at the Realtime Crime Center listening sessions, the police chief claimed that they needed additional software to analyze all of the video that they were collecting. I wonder at what point will the Durham Police Department have all the technology that they require to reduce crime? Maybe instead we should invest in what we know works.

I suggest taking this money and investing it into heart, which is a crucial program that I have personally seen be a gamecher for my unhoused neighbors, providing them with um resources like new like a new wheelchair and with housing and with access to social workers. I think we should expand HART to be available 247 and stop spending millions and millions of dollars on technology that the police department does not seem to be using to reduce crime. >> Thank you.

All right, colleagues, at this time at this time, I'll entertain a motion to authorize the city manager to execute a contract with Dana Safety Supply of Greensboro, North Carolina for the upfitting of 40 patrol vehicles for the total amount of $610,31720. >> So moved. It's been moved. Is there a second?

Second. >> All right, Madam Cler, please open the vote. >> Please close the vote. >> And the motion post uh passes unanimously.

>> Thank you. All right. Next item number 12. >> Yeah.

>> All right. Next item. Uh

first amendment to ARPA Corona virus state local fiscal recovery fund subawward agreement between city of Durham and Hayes Promise Community Development Corporation St. Joseph Historic Foundation Incorporated. This item has been pulled by the public. The first speaker I have is Jen Wickman, followed by Angel Deset Isad Doer and Anita Scott Neville and CJ Brick.

Welcome. You have three minutes. >> Thank you. Good evening and thank you for asking me to speak tonight. My name is Jen Wickman. I prefer going by

gentrifier. Um and I am speaking on this issue. I say yes. pass these two resolutions.

Let's move this money around. This is what my fourth husband taught me. The more you move money and make acronyms like CDC and ARPA funds, the easier it is to use those funds to pay for things without pesky community input or oversight. We live in a capitalist system.

We are here to create abundance, not to listen to the impacted community or move at the speed of trust. The point is, have you seen that land? It is such a big, beautiful blank slate. Let's utilize it to build more condos and

apartments at, say my favorite words with me, market rate. And please, I assume you all know the origin of the name Hayai. My daughter Hummus just learned it in school. And look, black history is important.

It gets a whole month every year. And there is not a racist bone in my body. I do not see color. But violence is never warranted ever, ever under any circumstances.

My goodness. Except for J6. Okay. Naming a whole neighborhood after a violent insurrection.

What's next? Having a Nat Turner apartment building. A Denmark Vzy neighborhood. Anyway, they can keep the name.

That can be a compromise. We could name the new market condo rates Hay Thai Heritage Square. I saw the Hay Thai plan from 2023

that was developed from and within community members and I saw that it was unanimously approved by city council at that time. And I think it's really smart what y'all have been doing since then. Moving that money around so nobody really knows what's happening and just pluck out the good parts of the plan and maybe do some of those. It's like my mother always told me, pick out the best parts of things like the cornflakes in your mac and cheese casserole and just let other people have what you don't want.

Thank you. Thank you. Next. >> Good evening, Mayor Williams and members of the Durham City Council. My name is Anita Scott Nate uh Neville. I am a native of Durham and a member of one of the business families that uh thrived in

the heyday of the business district on Pedigrew Street before urban removal and currently I serve as the uh director of haty reborn which is a community advocacy council. Um this evening I come before you with a very simple plea. Make it make sense. I did not know the speaker before me.

I was interested in how you all were receiving her sometimes humorous most of the time ironic presentation. But you can pick and choose from her presentation. Some of it rings uh in in step with my plea that you make it make sense. On June 13th, 2022 at the monument of faith church during a special session of city council, our then mayor, Elaine O'Neal, made a public

vow to do something about Hatai and the community's efforts to restore the area. Lots of advocacy and research preceded her vow. Specifically, in November 2022, the Urban Land Institute report was presented to the community and included a strong recommendation that Hatai needed to unify for community member self-governance. In response, Mayor O'Neal worked with other community leaders and created Hay Thai One Voice. Um, since then, the community has looked forward to receiving the benefits of the $10 million and its al allocation for improvements along the Fedville Street corridor. During the first year, when we all were learning, inquiries about the status of this spending for the fund were answered with frustration about the stringent ARPA guidelines for spending.

Most recently, however, I have received notification of some activity of the Hay Thai Promise CDC, specifically a cemetery project at Beachwood, which is a city-owned property. While this property provides a final resting place for many African-American citizens and historians of Durham, it is not clear what criteria Hay Promise is using to identify and allocate funding in the spirit of why the fund was created. Since the time that the CDC was formed under the opaces of the Hatai Heritage Center until now, we are asking that um your recommendation to rem to remove the Hay Heritage Center as the fiscal authority and do what with the 10 million? Please make it plain. Please make it clear what this changes that are suggested in items 12 and 13 how they

will benefit the community. Thank you. >> Next. >> Good evening.

Angel is Doure Historic Pine Street in the Hay Thai community. I'm speaking about item 12 um because I want to take this back so that we can be really clear about what's happening. This is an administrative cleanup when in fact you all are looking at the final step of laundering a deeply compromised process. The city is being asked tonight to remove St.

Joseph's Historic Foundation as fiscal sponsor in order to free up funds. But those funds were only entangled in the first place because of a series of actions that this body has not yet reckoned with. First, Hatai

Promise CDC was created improperly. It was formed by Angela Lee without the knowledge or consent of the St. Joseph's Historic Foundation board. That alone invalidates everything that followed.

Second, credit for this work was reassigned through collusion, not community process. The plan originated from my work and presentations in late 2022 and early 2023. After that, city officials and representatives from partner organizations began treating Hayai Promise CDC as the rightful owner of the project while discrediting and erasing the people who actually built it. Third, the board was coerced into fiscal sponsorship.

When resistance surfaced, Keith Chadwell was brought into explaining why sponsorship was necessary. That is not neutral assistance. That is city power being used to steer a nonprofit board

into a decision it did not freely make. There is a recording of this meeting. Now almost 3 years later, the city is proposing to undo that sponsorship, not because the process was wrong, but to move the money again and deliver it to the same CDC that was illegitimately created and improperly credited. That is not governance.

That is retroactive justification. That's the shell game being played with community impact that has long been promised to the historical residents of the Hayhai, Southside, Stokesdale, Tuscaloosa, St. Teresa. I can keep going on neighborhoods. Removing the fiscal sponsor without first addressing how we got here rewards deception, validates coercion, and exposes the city to significant legal risk. This community was destroyed by intentional policy decisions, highways,

displacement, urban renewal, and yet tonight, the city is again positioning itself as the quiet manager of a CDC that claims to represent Hay Thai. >> Thank you. >> I am asking that you halt any decision-making on Hay Thai Promise and removing St. Joseph's Historic Foundation.

>> Thank you. >> Until there is an independent investigation. >> Thank you. Miss uh Doer, you can remain at the mic because I have you next on the item.

>> I'm sorry. No, just one moment. I have to >> Yeah, I have to take action on that one first. >> Mr.

Mayor, CJ Brick had signed up for >> Oh, that's right. The the last one. My my apologies. Good evening, members of the city council. I am CJ Brick, uh, president and CEO of the Greater Durham Black

Chamber of Commerce. Um, and we have about 330 or 40 members, and one of the best jobs I have to do is to advocate for those members. So, I get phone calls and emails all the time um, asking me questions uh, many times about um, or or not just asking me questions, but also asking me to to speak on behalf of our membership. Uh this is one of those occasions um after your last work session um which I watched if I'm not in if I'm not in in in the council meeting or in the or in the chambers or in in the in in the other meeting room I'm typically watching and listening um and I watched the last uh work session meeting uh went back and watched it again and so I was assured I I try to look at how how this body acts and I thought to myself there's no way this is going to be and a an agenda today um based on the conversations that happened that Thursday and the things that were asked for and so on and so forth. And so uh I was surprised to see an agenda today. Um the many questions that have

been asked of me from my membership of over 300 members. Um I I don't have the answers for I don't I've asked some of you. I don't think you have the answers for and uh it's for that reason um that I would ask you to hold any decision-m on this item and push it to a later date until there's some more discussion and um and and and community um you know clarity around what's happening here. Um, this is particularly important because uh um you know representing leading a black le organization and and and engaging with government is is always complicated everywhere, but it's but it's it's certainly complicated here in Durham as well.

And one of the things that um that that the community always thinks about is is you know, do you get listened to? Do you get um do do your colleagues or do your your your your council members take you all seriously as a community, right? And I think that that is um that is at the heart of what I think is is is here is uh will you all

pause and listen and take the community seriously? Um and I think this is also interesting. Um I I'll just make one one more quick point and I'll take my seat. um the way broadly speaking the city did this ARPA um um allocation if you will broadly speaking right I remember it because I was one of the judges on round one and initially there were going to be two rounds with this with this process and and it switched from being two rounds to one round and and so I think there there's space to um to hold for inquiry and and community understanding before we move forward.

Uh with that, I'll yield. Thanks. >> Thank you, colleagues. Uh due to the nature of uh where all of our agenda items are sensitive in their own right, uh but I am going to ask staff to provide a clear explanation of where we are on this, how we got here, because I I know it's going to be reported on, and I don't want just descent to be

reported. >> He he he's new to the >> I'm new, y'all, so forgive me. Uh good evening. So, uh Mr.

Mayor, what what uh question would you like clarity on? >> I I'm I'm sure you've heard some of the community uh members who showed up here tonight uh their concerns, but uh there there are some >> pretty consistent concerns of we we're, you know, we're taking St. Joseph off or whatever. >> Yeah.

>> I just want to just provide a clear explanation of how we got here. um because in in fact uh the city is not proposing to remove them. They they requested to remove themselves. So I just want to be able to put some facts out there.

Uh and and of course you heard some of the concerns tonight. I want to make sure that we can provide some sense of response to that. >> And Mr. Gun, please do introduce yourself.

>> Yep. Absolutely. Joshua Gun, director of the Office of Economic and Workforce Development. Uh in October of this year, we were notified by the St. an attorney representing the St. Joseph's Historic Foundation that they would like to be

removed as the fiscal agent for the Hayatai Promise CDC. Uh the Hayatai Promise CDC board's attorney promptly responded to accept their uh desire to resign. So this this agenda item is specifically related. It's a very this this particular agenda item is a simple request from the Hatai from the St.

Joseph's Historic Foundation to be removed as a fiscal agent uh which the hat promise CDC is asking to accept. >> Thank you. I'll hold there because we have another agenda item that is very similar. Cool.

Council member, >> thank you, Mr. Gun. So, just a couple follow-up questions for you in regards to um so are we like just want to get clarity for the record. You're saying that um this hat promise will no longer have a fiscal agent and that would come in house to the city or what would be the role of the city in this process?

Yeah. So, uh this particular agenda item is so agenda item 12 is simply to remove St. Joseph's exto foundation uh with the

following agenda item related to the city acting as that fiscal agent. Uh essentially the the CDC no longer requires a fiscal agent uh based on finance staff's assessment of the risk associated with this organization. uh it has the ability to keep its own books and manage its own finances, which is essentially what the fiscal agent does. And so the CDC will continue to do what it's always done, which is keep its own books.

The city will continue to do what it's always done, which is have oversight over the invoices as they are paid. So functionally, there is no change other than the fact that uh St. Joseph's Foundation is long no longer the fiscal agent for the CDC. >> So I have a follow-up question for you.

In St. Jose's time is served as a fiscal agent. Were they fairly consistent in their reporting? >> Uh so I I don't have a lot of information on that. Uh I might lean on some someone else from staff here uh around their role as fiscal agent. Uh maybe Summer can lean on that or Tim.

>> Good evening, Mr. Mayor, members of council, manager Summer Alustin, Office of Economic and Workforce Development. Can you repeat the question if you would please? >> So um was the when St.

chose us was the fiscal agent where they're consistent in their reporting. I do see some timelines. Thank you all for submitting the contracts over to the clerk. So I do see those intervals in for reporting to the city where they feel they're consistent in their duties as a fiscal agent.

>> So if I understand the question right, hat promise has been consistent in its reporting to the city as requested. Is that what you're asking? >> It's not what I'm asking. Okay.

So we have had um St. Joseph Historic as the fiscal agent. Correct. So they would be the ones submitting the reimbursements to the city or how that process worked out?

>> No, it was never structured that way actually. >> Okay. So how was it structured? >> It was structured the way that director Gun just described which is Hey Promise has always kept its own books a separate set of accounting. What the role of the fiscal agent was was to ensure that they were staying compliant with the federal grant guidelines. Okay?

>> And not it was not to do their stuff for them. It was to help them as an matter of oversight if needed >> because I'm confused based on our Friday conversation that you told me that you were submitting the request to the city because they had failed to operate in their capacity. So has that changed from Friday to Monday? The structure that has actually been in place since the beginning is that because there was enough level of complexity to the compliance items that whatever hat promise task that they wanted to accomplish I would help them by coming to the ARPA team and to the attorneys and saying can we compliantly do this how do you help them structure this so that when we go forward and they do it there's not a backlash that it wasn't compliant And so that's the process that we started in the beginning. And I've been doing that on their behalf ever since so that there would never be a point where the fiscal agent had to call them out for being non-compliant

in terms of how the money was being spent. And so that's what we talked about on Friday that I've been helping with that comp compliance piece throughout. So it wouldn't be retro. They had the ability to find out in advance if they were on the right track.

Okay. So, that' be all the questions I have for item 12. I do have some other questions around 13. >> I And yeah, go ahead, Council Member Cook.

>> I just want to get some clarity. Um, Mr. because I I heard you say that CDC no longer requires a fiscal agent, which is different from what we heard in the meeting on Thursday where we were told that the city could now serve as the fiscal agent, but there was no conversation that no fiscal agent was needed. >> I might look to Tim for this.

I >> Yep. >> I have a response, but maybe I'll lean on finance. >> Hello, Tim Flor, city finance director. So, it's not necessarily a requirement.

I mean, it was a it was a requirement through a risk assessment that we did as a requirement for the federal government that we had to go through a risk assessment. Since the CDC was a new organization, they scored low on the risk assessment, which is why we why we the city required them to have the fiscal agent. It wasn't that it was a federal requirement. It was because of the risk assessment is why we as the city required them to have the fiscal agent.

Since that time, CDC has been we the bookkeeping there's there's been very few invoices that we've that we've re received. And so through the complexity of what we've been seeing, we uh in the city, me uh ultimately decided we did no longer needed to require um that fiscal agent because we had sufficient resources in the city to oversee uh any of those requirements. >> Yeah. So, so not functioning as a fiscal agent, the the simply continuing to have oversight, which the city's already done.

>> Yeah. I feel like I for some reason I feel like it's like a bit circular where I and I can't quite like figure out where the edges are, which is that ARPA money required a fiscal agent. Well, it didn't require it, but we we determined that to distribute the ARPA money that there was a fiscal agent required because we did not have familiarity with this with this group. We assigned a fiscal agent, which was St.

Joseph's um at the time. Um Summer is shaking her head, but you're nodding, so I don't Maybe I'm saying something incorrectly. >> No, what part? >> I I don't think we assigned the fiscal agent.

>> They they agreed to be the fiscal agent. >> They agreed to be the fiscal agent. Yeah. Thanks for clarifying that.

>> Okay. They agreed to be the fiscal agent at the time. However, before they could do their stuff on the back end, the city was already kind of serving as the fiscal agent on the front end because we just heard comments from staff that there were checks being done on the receipts that were being submitted ahead of time so that on the back end that the fiscal agent wouldn't have to step in.

It it just is like so strange that we were already doing that work that we didn't have the capacity to do before and that's why we asked them to have a fiscal agent but now we're saying that we can do that work anyway. >> I'm confused. So part of this is uh we were building the ARPA structure as we were going because this was a whole new program. And so as we were working through this process, the the US Treasury Department was also always revising their guidelines.

And so we were always trying to stay with or ahead of the guidelines. And so part of those guidelines were to have that risk assessment because we needed sort of fiscal security to ensure that they were going to be compliant with all of the federal regulations that we have to be compliant with in order to do that. So we uh we were probably being overly cautious by in addition to what we were asking the organizations to do with their fiscal uh their fiscal agents, we were also probably doing a lot of that work on internally as well. Which is again another reason why when the

discussion came up and they asked to be removed as the fiscal agent, it was an easy decision for me because we already we we had that track record under our belt. There were only a few organizations that we actually required it because CDC was a new organization and they had no no track record of understanding and following federal guidelines. That is why we we required a a fiscal agent. >> But to be clear, Tim, I do want to clarify, we there were other organizations who received ARPA funds who we required to have a fiscal agent all because they were new or inexperienced in in federal funds.

So this was not unique to hesai promise CDC and those agreements remained in place until such a time as there was you know they remained in place because we have not had a request to change them in this case. >> That's correct. >> The change is because the organization who served has requested to be removed. It is not a city initiated process.

>> Correct. We did not ask for that. They asked for it and this was our

opportunity to say okay. >> Yes, I understand that. I guess I'm also confused about how we are considering them to have demonstrated the ability to work without a fiscal agent if we were checking their stuff on the front end. It sounds like we are now saying that we have the capability of serving for the fiscal agent, but the fiscal agent is really just a backend situation of like if things have been reported inappropriately comes back.

>> Yeah, simply compliance. >> It sounds like we've actually been doing front-end work to ensure that those things haven't been done incorrectly. So, I'm confused about how this organization was then able to build up um a track record of doing it right if we were helping them do it. >> It I think it's just a compliance mechanism, right?

I don't think it's a judgment of doing it right or wrong. it's being compliant and my understanding is that city staff was there to help as Tim mentioned as additional due diligence right to make sure that this organization was remaining compliant with the federal resources and they have continued to do that. I think also understanding the

nature of the work has changed. Right? I think in the beginning we we the city did not quite know how many transactions would be needed to do the work, what the size of the transactions would be, what the scope what the scale of the work would be. We understood the scope of the work which is detailed in their contract, but that has evolved significantly.

And I think the finance team, not to speak for uh uh director Flora, has recognized that it is much less of a staff lift than they initially thought and that staff now has capacity to support the entity. Uh this is simply a compliance question, not a strategy or uh question of right or wrong. And in combined, I know we haven't gotten to the next item yet, but in combination with the next item, which we are now moving this out of ARPO to lessen the deadlines or to change the deadlines, then we also are not going to have the same federal reporting requirements as before. Anyway, can you just talk about like how that interplays with this? I mean, have we been holding them to those standards the entire time? Do we have a

plan to move them out of the ARPA funds? Are we moving other people out? Can you just help me understand how that all works? >> The answer to one part of that is yes, we have been holding them to the to the correct standards because we haven't made a change in the funding source.

Uh I I don't want to speak out of order because I think that's item 13. So I'm looking at uh Mr. Mayor in terms of >> Do we need to speak to item 13 till we get there? >> Okay.

But happy to speak to it when we get there for sure. >> Okay. Those are all my questions. May >> thank you.

I don't really have any questions. I just want to provide a little bit of [clears throat and cough] additional information because um I was on council at the time when we were doing so was the mayor when we did the public process um and this was part of that public process. So the city has added capacity because the folks who were monitoring many of the organizations have spent their money. They are done but we still have staff that are dedicated to ARPA.

So when we're talking about capacity this isn't maybe to your question council member Cook. This is more to the the public and those folks watching. We have added

capacity because they're not as busy because a lot of the contracts are done. People have spent their money. There's no longer what it was like 25 organizations initially that we gave funding to. A lot of those dollars are done.

A lot of those contracts are closed. A lot of the work has been completed. And so it has allowed city staff to keep providing that technical assistance for those folks who still have outstanding dollars. So I think that's where the capacity comes from.

At least that's my understanding. um at the time um when St. Joe's was chosen. It was also seen as a good convenor of these funds.

And so that that is why the initiate the decision was made. Who's going to hold this money? Who's going to be the convenor in this space? And it was decided that this was a very wellrespected organization that had a lot of community trust. And so it seemed like from a risk assessment uh the right choice for the city to to put the CDC and have them be the fiscal agent. So I just want to pro provide a little bit of additional reasoning as to why at least

as it was explained to me as a council member at the time why that decision was made and people at the time felt good about that decision. I understand that people may not feel good about that now but at the time it felt like the right decision based on the information that we have. Thank you. >> Well this isn't really a statement well a question for Mr.

Gun. So just apologize you're up here. It's more so that I at this moment don't feel as though I have sufficient information to make an informed decision. I've had discrepancy after discrepancy last week when I asked questions.

I've heard three different stories about certain items. And so I feel as though to make sure we have community trust. I'm not here to settle anyone's score, but I want to make sure I'm doing what I was elected to do and serve our constituents in the best I can do. And since there's been so many different stories about what we can and what we cannot do, I really am not comfortable moving forward. I really thought this needs to go back to staff until we could provide like clarity on what's actually happening, how we got here. But also, we were told in the work session the other week that the money

was going to be take removed from the ARPA and it was going to go to like a health fund or another fund of money. Then I asked about it on Friday. I was like, "Oh, no, that's not true. " So those little things kind of gave me a little reluctancy in terms of moving forward.

I know folks are saying this is simply, you know, we're amending a contract. I get that. But in policy, you do have an evaluation period. And so it is our job to make sure we are evaluating how policies are implemented.

And I have noticed several flaws. And I'm not putting blame on anyone, but I think there's a time we can actually be more efficient in this. And I have not seen that yet. So I would hope my colleagues will support me.

And I think that we need a little bit more information to um make a sound decision about what's happening. I know some of us were not on council when this decision was made, but some of us were very active in the community and we understand the breakdown. And so in order for us to be judicious and spend this money because it's much needed. I'm not saying that the Hay tai quarter does not need to we need a lot more than $10 million. But we have to have community trust as well and that is ensured by making sure that we all have alignment and that has

not been created over the past week. If not after every meeting I've had I've left with more questions. So those are my comments for >> Thank you Mr. Mayor.

So, one point of clarification for me. We have item 12 and item 13. Um, can they exist separate from each other? >> I guess perhaps it's a question to to stab because it feels like we're making a sequential decision considering one considering another.

>> There are two different actions. >> They're two different actions, but it seems like they are intertwined. Can we take one action without the other? >> They're not necessarily intertwined, right?

And I think I appreciate you raising that as a point of clarity. Item 12 is a very simple item. It's simply asking if we can do what the St. Joseph's Historic Foundation has asked us to do, which is amend the contract. Item 13 talks about the funding source and some of those additional uh conversations. Uh they are certainly separate issues that council has the

discretion at deciding separately. >> Okay. So then on item 12, uh and I appreciate the call uh from one of our our our speakers and community leaders to make it make sense. I think that's a perfectly reasonable request and it's what I'm hearing from my my my colleague uh um council member Burrus as well.

Uh my question is I'm trying to understand the implications of voting uh yes on 12 or the implications of sending it back to staff. Um so starting off if we vote yes um you know can we can can we go through an accountability process where we get everybody on council uh uh including myself who's who's new on the same page about what's happening with uh hate promise CDC. Let me respond and say yes. Uh council member, we are happy to from an OWD staff standpoint provide as much detail and information uh at the

city manager's uh if the city manager wishes, we can do a full presentation on past, present, and future uh of our the city's role in helping the CDC. I'm sure we could engage the CDC's board in that work as well. We're we're happy to do that. Uh I would suggest that item 12 or nor 13 prevents us from doing that at some point in the future either.

Uh kicking it back to staff in my estimation would ask us to just I don't know what we do beyond uh hey St. Joseph's Historic Foundation is already asked to no longer be the fiscal agent. If you kick that component of it back to staff, that leaves us in a place where uh I'm not quite sure what what other amendments we could make, but we can't force them to be the fiscal agent. we could reconsider the process around uh there's lot lots of layers that can happen after that. Uh but the simple ask here is if we can do what they've asked us to do. Uh and none of that none of doing that precludes us from offering council as much insight and transparency

as you asked for. >> Just to jump in real quick, uh council member, I've been requesting that we keep the items separate because a lot of what we're hearing is related to item 13. a lot of concern. Uh 12 and staff, correct me if I'm wrong.

This is simply to remove or to honor the request of who's ser currently serving as the fiscal agent. >> Correct. >> Correct. >> If we do not vote on this, then what we're doing is forcing someone to stay as the fiscal agent, which we really can't do that.

>> So, if I can can I continue? Yep. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

>> So, then if we vote yes on 12 to remove St. Joseph's and have the city play this role. Um, so, so I guess I'll just answer my own question. So, it sounds like we're in a position to get community input including on providing direction on the future of funding and even changing direction if needed.

Like all of those things are possible uh if we vote yes on 12 and change this arrangement. >> Yeah, I think absolutely open to a public process for that. Sure. I mean

that that that I think was the spirit of this from the very beginning. >> Okay. So, in terms of if we vote to send it back to staff, um, you know, what changes? Like, can Hai Promise CDC fulfill their current commitments or money has been legally obligated if we send this back?

>> I'm going to look to Summer to respond to that. >> Council members, Summer Austin, repeat the question for me. So, so if we vote to send this back to staff instead of agreeing to this change, um, you know, for example, the arrangement you have with preserving home >> where you've where you have obligated certain funds where you've contracted to do certain activities >> where hop promises cont. >> Exactly.

Right. So, are you are you limited in doing that if we vote to delay moving this item and we vote send it back to staff? Does that does that >> that is an interesting question and I'm

going to ask both legal and finance to jump in when they see fit because it might be a bit out of my wheelhouse. But I think the the the basic answer is is that hey promise can keep going doing what they've been doing unless and until the city makes a decision to terminate the agreement with them which hopefully would be based on some quantifiable cause. >> Okay. But that doesn't have a factor for this item 12.

Like item 12 would not impede or change their ability to execute um that work >> technically right this minute. I don't think so. But what it would do is it would take a board of nine volunteers and put them in a very odd place in terms of the the hours that they're dedicating to this work. So that's if I can carry on. I I would advise the council that if if you took that action

that my interpretation to the board of CDC promise is that the uh hey promise CDC is that the council has questions about the current work program of the CDC and that that would be it would be reasonable for them to interpret that as a chilling effect on activities that they're taking right now. Um if if that is not the message council intends to send that I would ask council to articulate that tonight. Otherwise the the direction from the council not to proceed with the fiscal aation uh fiscal agent transition based on concerns that we've heard about how the CDC is spending funds or allocating funds. Uh it would be reasonable for the CDC to hear that and interpret that. So, I think committed funds that the CDC has committed, uh, it would be reasonable, as those decisions have been made prior to tonight, that staff work with the CDC to continue to honor those commitments. Any new commitments, I would recommend,

would be placed on hold based on what council's expressing, unless council wants to articulate that that is not their intention. Uh, because we're our our job is to try and make sure that whatever you're deciding tonight is is is conveyed appropriately to the folks who are doing it. So, I have heard questions around clarity on how decisions get made about how the funds have been spent. I've heard director Gun offer for us to bring that forward.

Should council pause tonight because you indicate you want that further clarity, I would interpret that as a level of concern being expressed about how those decisions are being made and and my guidance to the CDC would be that they not move forward and that uh if they wish to discuss that with the council, again, we do not speak for the CDC. We do not program the CDC's work. They're an independent board. Uh our staff is a liaison to them to help facilitate that clo work closely with the work of economic development, but they are not uh they are not uh a creature of the city. So, you know, ultimately I do not

want to speak for what the CDC would decide to do because again, they get to make those decisions. But I think speaking for the staff who would communicate this conversation to the CDC, it would be that council heard concerns about how the funds uh are being allocated or spent. Uh they did not want to move forward on these items that would facilitate those funds continuing to be committed and that the CDC has been asked to through our staff bring forward a presentation to council. So that that is how I would direct staff in this case uh based on this conversation unless council clarified that that is not their intent in which case whatever you clarify for me is what we will convey to the CDC.

>> Okay. So just to clarify my intent is not to hold St and I'm very clear on that. My intent is not to hold St. Joseph historic to anything. Right. I simply am just trying and to the city manager's point, we're simply requesting clarity and it has been hard to achieve that at this point and so I want to make

sure we have concrete answers which is why I'm asking to send this back to staff to make sure we are making an informed decision. It's not it sounds like the relationship broke down a while ago honestly. So I we're not holding them some compliance things or I don't want to get to all of the banter. All I'm asking for is these two items to go back and I'm not saying indefinitely.

I know there's a time constraint but we are in January. I don't foresee this taken until December to resolve. I just want us to have a little bit more concrete information about what has happened dynamic of relationship and how we can move forward. That's it.

So to the city manager's point, that's what we are I am requesting explicitly is a presentation on what has occurred thus far and make sure we have all consistent information about what has happened. So I don't know whomever needs to take point on that, but that would be awesome to have. I asked this question at the work session, but I'm going to ask it again. Um, we are not in privity of contract with St. Joseph's in any way. Is that

correct? >> Help me. >> We do not have a contract with St. Joseph.

Y'all corrected my language so intensely that we did not even designate them. This was entirely done by CDC. Is that correct? >> Yeah.

>> Um, I'm still confused why this is an agenda item. I guess I'm confused by this whole thing, but uh we don't have either the right to keep them in a contract nor the right to keep to withhold them or keep them from leaving the contract. And if I recall correctly, the contract allowed them to freely come and go as long as they gave notice. And they gave like ample notice is my understanding.

Um so we don't we're not even a party to them. I don't know why. what what does this >> so their name is on the contract and so agenda item number 12 is only a part of the agenda because it really it it's tangentially tied to agenda item 13 and since we were making a funding change on 13, it was my decision after uh legal uh

opinion with this that this did not the item 12 did not need to come to council but since it was two items of one um sort of package I asked ask that both items come forward. So, so part I I will take responsibility for that. So, technically technically this item does not item 12 does not need to come to council, but because it was related to item 13 um and it was that $10 million packet and we were trying to split the the the revenue re the revenue replacement piece that we we've talked about at the work session. I suspect we'll be talking about here on the next agenda item.

Um, I ask that this item for an abundance of transparency, um, that it be brought to council. >> Well, you I think that Yes. Are you trying to answer this question? I would love it because I to me it seems like there's an action that we don't there's no action for us to take and so I'm confused like how we take an action, >> right?

Yeah. And I just wanted to address a comment that you made a second ago, which is St. Joseph's Historic Foundation is not a party. They are a party to the contract. So that's the whole point of this >> and we're in privy of contract with

>> item. Well, well, if you look at the contract that's in the agenda, that's the proposed amendment to the contract is to remove St. Joseph's Historic Foundation as a party. >> Okay.

Yeah. This is a and this is an issue I think that we've come up with before where we like see amended contracts but not original contracts. I have it up and I guess that's part of what's confusing to me. >> Right.

So, it it shows the strike through. So, it's it's showing you the original language. At least I'm looking at it. >> What page are you?

Yeah, the original. Good. Thank you, Council Member Burrus. So, the original is is attachment four, but if you look at attachment two, that's the proposed amended contract, and you'll see that St.

Joseph's Historic Foundation was a party. It was a three-party contract, and they are looking to amend the contract to remove that party. Um, and also, uh, senior assistant city attorney Carlos Hernandez is legal

counsel on this issue. He is on, um, the Zoom if you want to ask, you know, some in-depth legal questions about that. >> Yeah. I mean, I my and I yall have to forgive me because it's been a week, 10 days since I've read the contract, but my understanding was that they could withdraw at any time.

Is that is that true? St. Joseph's >> that they could withdraw under the under that contract. >> Yes.

>> I'm going to defer to Carlos because he he knows that contract. I don't. >> No. We have a unilateral right to withdraw from the contract.

U they're contractually bound to act as a fiscal agent uh until an amendment or release is is done by the city. So they they don't have the ability to unilaterally withdraw. They have a separate agreement with a promise CDC and and their agreement between the two of them on how they will interre interact with each other. We're not privy to that contract, but they do have a contractual uh

obligation with the city to act as as fiscal agents. So, uh they don't have that unilateral right to just leave the contract. >> So, we can require performance then potentially we are in privity. But that answers my question.

Thank you. All right. [clears throat] So, any other question? Yeah, go ahead.

>> I had a question for council member Burrus. Are you wanting I I appreciate the want for more information and I think that that's fine and I'm not trying to tease the two items together, but it seems like number 12 is quite straightforward. Yeah. >> And number 13 maybe that's where there's a little bit more consternation.

So, I'm wondering if if if council is comfortable with moving forward on 12 and then referring that number 13 back, but I didn't know where you were with that. >> Everyone has free will. I know where I'm at on it. So, I'm not because I did not receive what I needed to make an I get

what they're saying, but it shouldn't have taken a week for us to kind of resolve this whole thing out. So, I don't feel comfortable moving forward anything until I get more information. So, majority >> comfortable with 12 or 13. >> Okay.

Yeah, go ahead. >> Thank you. I appreciate colleagues having wanting more information and and and I think the funding source is the the murkier part at least for me. I'm comfortable with moving forward on item 12.

Um and when we get to 13, we can have that discussion. >> Yeah, we uh I I appreciate all my colleagues comments, but this is why we have a vote. we'll um we we'll vote on it and and determine what happens and um but I do I do think that you know some of the uh um points you made council member Burrus are are valid. Um but I I I do feel comfortable moving forward as well. So I I'll go ahead and call for a vote on this one. Um,

so I'll entertain a motion to authorize the city manager to execute a first amendment to the Arbor subreient grant agreement with Hayai Promise Community Development Corporation to remove St. Joseph's Historic Foundation Incorporated as fiscal agent in an amount not to exceed $3,245,000. >> Could I move? >> Can I ask a clarifying question?

>> Discussion. Yeah. >> Um, did you want to do the movement in a second before? >> It's been moved and probably seconded.

question. >> I don't think it got seconded, but I'll second it. Okay. Um I it if there was a conversation about sending it back to staff, that would not be a no vote on this.

So, I'm wondering if we need a separate conversation about this agenda item because that was I think what council member Burrus had asked for. And I don't think that the the thing is that we want to say no necessarily, but that the request was for more time. someone. >> Well, no, it was it was stated that she didn't feel comfortable moving forward with it, >> right? >> But it wasn't a request for a motion.

>> She Okay. Um, council member, did you want to make a motion to >> um to have more time on this and send it back to staff? >> The alternative, I think, is right now that the motion before us is that we vote yes or no on the agenda item as it is on the on the agenda. I'm fine >> for this item for item 12 I'm fine with because it's simply the amendment for the contract and so with the fiscal sponsor we can't hold them in relationship so I'm fine with voting how I feel like voting on this case more so I don't need more time for that one >> all right and my apologies council members I thought you were seconding were you making a comment >> no I think I I made the motion I think >> oh okay >> Cook seconded okay it's been moved and probably seconded madam clerk please open the vote Please close the vote.

>> And the motion passes 6 to one with council member Burrus voting no. >> Thank you. Item 13. >> Uh Mr.

Mayor, there were two. Yeah. In the second, um, I'll entertain a motion to authorize the city manager to negotiate and make sub subsequent modifications to the amended ARPA subreient grant agreement with Hai Promise Community Development Corporation so long as total grant funds do not exceed 3,245,000. >> So move second.

>> It's been moved and properly seconded. Madam Clerk, please open the vote. Please close the vote. >> And the motion passes six to one with council member Burrus voting no.

>> Thank you. Item 13, amendment to contract number 20910 with Hay Promise CDC St. Joseph and uh

number 21481 for Fedville Street corridor neighborhood stabilization partnership implementation. All right, I'll start with the speakers. Uh, first up I have Anita Scott Neville, followed by Victoria Peterson, Angel Asset Doer, and Amanda Wallace. Welcome.

Three minutes. >> Yeah. Thank you again for the opportunity. I did not really get a chance to finish when I stood up earlier. However, uh I do appreciate uh the comprehensive approach to items 12 and 13, I appreciate that like some of us out here, you believed and felt the

need to look at both items together. I hope that going forward uh especially new council members will be uh diligent. Uh we talk about fidelity and transparency. Those are words that are used a lot in here and I hope that will be applied with the presentation that I hope will be prepared for you all to really understand and understand well enough so that you can share your understanding with the community so that we can begin to appreciate and look forward to another layer of promises for Hayai.

Thank you. >> Welcome, Miss Peterson. You have three minutes.

>> I'm Mrs. Peterson, Victoria Peterson. I've been a political activist in Durm for quite a few years. I'm very disappointed what the city council members have done here.

And I'll just cut right to the chase. This organization, and this is the paperwork from the city that stated the St. Joseph Historical Foundation was a fiscal agent for $10 million. a physical agent that was supposed to be watching, guarding, and overseeing 10 million dollar, but tonight all they've been talking about is 3 million and 6 million. Somebody has been terribly dishonest of the people's monies. These are federal dollars that was supposed to

come particularly in the African-American community. And I don't care if you were a white organization, a black organization, a red organization, a green organization. You were responsible for these monies. So here's my question to the city c.

And here it is. I'm not lying. Right here, this is what the city put out. $10 million to help them to work with organizations on that quarter.

So, here's my question to the city council members. Where's the $10 million? What has happened to it? What have they done with it?

Have they given monies to organizations to help them in the community? Mr. mayor, the city attorney, Miss Cook. I like to say Miss Cook cuz she's also attorney also. I'm not trying to beat up on her, but she's an attorney.

What happened to the $10 million? And where is it? And Mr. City Manager, I ain't trying to embarrass you, but I am going to have to.

I've asked you publicly several times for the interest that the city has generated off of about what I believe it was what about $50 million that we got from the federal government and the county got about 60 million. Where's the interest? And I've asked you and you know what you told me? You asked me to go ask somebody else.

You're the city manager. I want it in writing. I want to report on the interest that the city has generated. I also want to report on the $10 million. Mr. Mayor, I want to report on how these monies have been used and definitely about the

$10 million with St. Joseph. >> Please do not sign off anymore. Thank you >> for this organization and tell there's some accountability, Mr.

Mayor. >> Thank you. >> And thank you very much for allowing 10 million. >> Uh, next I have Angelet Doer.

>> That has not been 10 million. >> Angel is doer historic Pine Street. Um, I'm going to finish what I was saying earlier about item 12. Um, because it does connect and then I'm going to answer some of these questions that the staff clearly cannot answer. Um, I am still asking for there to be a halt on items 12 and 13 until an independent review is completed. preserve all records related to the formation of Hayai Promise, the fiscal sponsorship vote, and all communications involving

city officials. Also include impacted community leadership, including myself, co-author Kendra Presley, Hey Ty Reborn, St. Mark AM, the Greater Black Durham Business Chamber, and various Hatai communitycentric people and working groups within the Hay Thai community, including New Visions of Africa with Brother Casib. Anything less places this council on record as approving a funding switch built on misrepresentation.

Removing the fiscal sponsor without investigating how the CDC was fraudulently fraudulently formed and how the board was coerced is not cleanup. It's ratifying misconduct and this council will own the consequences. So, first of all, with regard to capacity, um, city staff has been involved in this process the entire time. Um, Summer, you

remember showing Ideal Ortiz your contract and your salary? Uh, you remember reaching out to me for coffee? So, Summer has said that she was put in charge of managing this CDC on behalf of the city. So, that's number one.

Capacity is a lie. There was no capacity issue. This was a clear shell game that took place in terms of crediting this to hey promise CDC. Um the rules were changed as they went to your point Mr.

Flora, and you might remember also with regards to my own personal um ARPA funding and how I have been cheated out of that money that you sent me a letter or you sent my attorney a letter with 12 typos in it and 12 budgetary mistakes. So, I have a hard time believing anything you say. I'm confused as to why

you're the CFO of the city of Durham. Um, with regard to St. Joseph's Historic Foundation asking to be removed. That this is true.

Um in October of 2025, they asked to be removed as um agents because they did not want to be affiliated with a fraudulently created CDC. Thank you. >> Thank you. Um as we are speakers, as you come to the mic, please make sure you address your comments to us as council members.

Thank you. Next, Miss Wallace. >> So, my name is Amanda Wallace. Um, and I was it was supposed to be two years before I could sit at this podium and have this conversation. So, glad to be back and I'm addressing my comments to the commission, I mean to the the city council. And I'm here to speak against um this hoodwink and bamboozling that the city is currently trying to do by

amending this contract. I am so confused. I am so confused at what this is. And I'm even more confused by sitting in this meeting today.

There's so many unanswered questions. Where? What? Like what has happened with the money so far?

It's been over a year, but we hear the city say, but now they feel more confident in them. Well, how how did how did you gain that confidence? What is actually happening? If you look at the mission of Hay Promise, it says that it's supposed to be a catalyst for building a vibrant future.

And then it's a whole lot of other words, but it's to preserve Fedville Street corridor. Where's the catalyst? What where is it? Because what I'm seeing is more like fires outside from people unhoused.

What I'm seeing is buildings continuing to stay vacant. Where is the catalyst? And now we're talking about this $10

million. I mean, we keep saying $10 million, but we still do not understand how much money is still sitting where it is. Again, it just seems like a bait and switch. And like you're saying, they want to remove like well St.

Joseph's Foundation wants to remove themselves, but nobody's asked like why? I mean, what we're hearing is that they didn't even know that it was happening in the beginning. But nobody's addressing that. It's just like, "Oh, no.

This is a simple fix. " But it's not simple. It's not simple when you're sitting on $10 million when people need resources. Now, there is no community trust.

No community trust there. I mean, there hasn't been community trust in a long time. Especially again, if we think about Hai, we think about urban renewal or urban removal. like this is what's happening again. Urban renewal was a was this a policy of

the federal government that came down to the city. The city is responsible for urban renewal and now here we are again. Here we are again. But again, this is why they want to ban people from the people's house because they don't want anybody to ask questions.

But with my 17 minute 17 seconds, I'm gonna say this again. Matt Copac, you bought your seat so that this could still keep being a 43 vote so that when issues like this come up, you can sway it and you can sit with your white privilege. >> Thank you. Thank you.

Yeah, there you go. Mr. Baker, welcome. You have three minutes.

>> Yeah. Again, [clears throat] uh good evening everyone. CJ Brick, uh president, CEO, Greater D Black Chamber

of Commerce. I just wanted to add to my comments from earlier. Um and um and just for the record, just take a moment to pause uh to for all of you. I mean, I think I've met all of you, seen you in meetings, and I have a pretty decent relationship with all of you.

Um, I don't come to this council meeting often. I don't speak often. Um, but when I do speak, I expect that, um, you'll entertain that request um, and at least pause and consider it and hopefully take the time to, uh, to do what I'm asking you to do. Um, as one of a handful of, um, black organizational leaders in in in Durham, um, I want to just share my experience with you, right? Um, you know, Durham professes itself to be this progressive town that, um, that that exposes all these values. But I think from my perspective, right, it's moments like this when people like me ask for

something, whether it's um when it could be as simple as a a pause on a decision or it could be something more more elaborate around um funding and it gets, you know, just rammed over. And so I want to appreciate uh Council Member Burrus for voting no on item 12. Again, I'm I'm going to field a dozen questions in the next couple days around um what happened, you know, and I'll obviously refer them um as best as I can to where the answers lie. But there's still a lot of misinformation and cloud around around, you know, as as as as Miss Peterson said, you know, the $10 million, right?

Items 12 and 13 and join. And so, um you know, I'm going to again ask you all to um to listen, right? and and and sometimes I know you're you're in difficult positions where you need to to move and move swiftly, but when when leaders that you're when when leaders that you see in

the community doing community work come and ask you for something like this, you know, I would ask that you um try to appreciate their engagement and um and slow down a little bit. I yield. >> Thank you. All right, that's Yeah, Council Member.

>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Yeah. Um, it seems to me there's two questions before us.

The staff have presented us with an agenda item about amending a contract and changing fiscal agency status. The staff did not come to us with a full-blown impact analysis of the investment we've made in HT Promise CDC. They've come to us with a contract amendment. There's a second question about the amend the impact of the $10 million.

It's a fair question. That's not what the staff prepared for us. There were questions at the work session. The manager responded with a list of expenses from the hat CDC was

asked for. I am I am sick and tired of the innuendo, the allegations that somehow staff have bamboozled or hoodwinkedked people, that my colleagues have stolen elections. We're here to do the people's business. This is not the people's business.

If there's a question about the impact of the grant that was given to Hatai Promise CDC, that agenda item can be properly brought before the council for a full discussion about the impact of the dollars we've given or the the ARPA dollars we've we've allocated. That's a separate agenda item that's fair to bring before the council. What we have here is a simple about a contract and to sort of take that item and suggest somehow there's again staff have fraudulently misinformed people. I'm sick and tired of that.

We have a contract before us. I'll take a vote on that contract. If there's a request for any kind of impact analysis, I'm here for that. That's what we're about to that we we have a right to oversee the spending we make as a c as a city. If

there's questions about that, let's bring that agenda item before the council. That's how we have here. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

>> Go ahead. Cuz colleagues, I will say I'm going to pause us at nine uh to take a break and then we'll continue. >> Oh, I'll be brief. So, um Councilman Ris, to your point, um imagine how people in the corridor feel.

If you're tired, imagine how tired they are. So, what we don't, and I'm not doing this for applause. I'm doing this I ride down Fedville Street every day. I'm a double graduate of NCCU.

I have seen this every day and we still have not received an investment. So for us to ask for accountability in an area that's been disinvested for decades like that you can't control how people respond. You can't control people who've been like how they respond to injustice. So I want to just honor that.

And for this item I will say that I 100% I got my motions together now. I do want to send this back because the extension is only until July 30th, 2027. That's 6 months. How are you going to spend this money within

that time frame or just give us some kind of signal or answer those clarifying questions for us to make an informed decision? I seeded on the first one, but before we move forward, I need to know because when I did ask for the detailed expenditures, I didn't get any dates. I got a list of items. I I want to know more about how staff has received reimbursements and what the cause for that was.

I want I have other questions about that. 3 million that have been expended and looking at what you have 1,700 for Wayfair. Someone got $1,000 reimbured to them or so. You have 300k to preservation durm.

We just want to have context about how these funds are being utilized in an actual plan to move forward. That's it. And that's what I'm asking for explicitly today is to get those details to make sure that we know how this money is going to be utilized in the corridor because it takes money to make money. 10 million is not sufficient for the work that needs to happen in this corridor.

So we want to make sure that we have community buying involvement because we need to attract other resources to fully address the deficits that have happened because we have not thoroughly invested in this community. So that is my statement. Thank you for your time. >> Right.

Um Mayor Po, >> thank you. Council Member Burroughs, could you state what questions you would like answered? I'm I'm amendable to um I [clears throat] will I will say that, you know, it is always a very and this is not to throw anyone under the anyone under the bus, but for me, the Fateville Street corridor, I've gone to community meetings. I have participated in listening sessions.

I have uh been invited where I'm invited. And the biggest block for me is that there's not a unity of vision. Different factions, and I'll say it, within the Fagetville Street corridor ask for different things. And it is hard as a decision maker to respond. We understand that the harm was caused. This was supposed to be a down payment,

this $10 million. It was never intended to fix the whole problem. We knew it wouldn't. But to council member Burrus's point, the idea was this is a down payment so that there could be other investment from the city, from the state, from the federal government, etc.

But it gets really, really hard when there is not a consistent vision from the different groups in Fayetteville Street corridor. It happened with Fyet Place, which is now I think villages at Hay Thai. It's happened with lots of community projects in that corridor. And that is what the challenge is for me as a decision maker.

It's very easy to say yes even if it's, you know, the money is always going to be hard to come up with. Like let's just be real. But it's really hard to say yes when you have different asks from different small pockets within a section of town. So I am happy to put pause on this.

I'm happy to get more clarity on it. I'm happy to do more transparency around it. But at a certain point, a decision just has to be

made so that we can move forward, so that we can put the investment that we need in the community that rightfully deserves it. And so that is my challenge. So I guess for me, what would be really helpful is you've asked for dates on expenditures, what are the other specific questions? And if you have a long list, I would encourage you to send it to all of your council members.

I I didn't participate in the meeting that you had with staff so that it's clear what the ask is to staff. so that it's clear that community who's shown up here, those are the questions that were asked. Those are the questions that were answered and we can all move forward together knowing that $10 million while not a lot is still a lot of money, right? It's not an insignificant amount of money.

Is it what's owed? Absolutely not. But it's not, you know, we we as a city council made the decision to put half of the ARPA dollars back in community. There are very few cities in the United States that made that decision with their ARPA dollars. Most cities did not do that. They took

the money and they backfilled their own coffers. And so, and that's the right decision to have made, but it made it a messy process, right? It made it a harder process for staff. It made it lots of different organizations got money.

And so I want folks to understand that the decision to put $22 million back into the community in the response to the pandemic is not a decision that most communities made. The county did it as well. We were lifted up nationally for making that decision and staff worked really, really hard to drive an equitydriven process. At the time, it was Council Member Williams and I along with Council Member Johnson had to steer the seven of us through a process that everyone could agree with.

It was a challenging thing to do. And I still stand by the work that we did and I stand by staff and the challenging decisions we had to make. But I really, really want our community to get together and work together and not have the inner fighting that I've

consistently seen in the Fagatville Street corridor. So, Council Member uh Burrus might ask of you is if you could send your questions to staff. I'm open to a delay uh as long as as we can get the thing moving. Thank you.

>> Okay. So, I want to recess for 10 minutes. >> 12. We're resume.

I came to [music] the city to develop leadership and supervisory skills. I stayed because of the city's culture and [music] dedication to serving residents. The city of Durham, where careers meet community. gov.

GV/careers >> recording stopped. >> I came to the [music] city for the great insurance and retirement benefits, but I save for the stability and vacation time. [music] The city of Durm, where careers meet community. go. gov/careers. [music]

I came to the city of [music] Durham to improve living conditions for residents. And I stayed because I'm encouraged to advance my career. The city of Durham, where careers [music] meet community. gov/careers. [music] [music] [music] >> [music] >> Durham [music] diagonal careers. >> [music]

>> Let's uh get back settled, said, "Gosh, All right, we are going to go ahead and

uh continue. [clears throat] >> All right, Mr. Mayor, at this point I'm prepared or ready to make a motion that we refer item 13 back to staff and I am committed to what my colleagues and let me know if I'm out of order with this but committed to sending over an exhaustive list of all the questions I have what we have collectively around this item to gain clarity. >> So second >> it's been moved and properly seconded.

I do have some discussion. Um do you mind stating your email? Uh, I mean, I know it's public, but for residents to directly email you so we can have all the questions received in the same >> Oh, sure. Why not?

Um, because I don't have an office assistant. Um, so my email is first name Shanetta SA TA. gov. >> That's me. So, yes, look forward to your inquiries being shared. I I am I am

asking basically for council member uh council member Burrus to uh take lead on uh accumulating these questions so that we could just have it all in one place. Uh I do want to project that I'm going to support your motion. U but I I do want to say um I I am I am a little frustrated. Uh I'm frustrated because there there are people who um there are a lot of people in this community and and you know I went to school in this neighborhood NC Central um been in Durham for a while and I've seen parts of the city evolve.

I've seen parts of the city um just develop and somehow someway this area is still the same. And I there's a lot of confusion around this because it's government speak. Uh some of the questions have been answered that need to be answered. Again, there's uh some some processes that are a little confusing, which is

why I agree with council member Burrus on some things. I I get it's very clear to me. I I I understand it, but I'm, you know, I'm one of seven up here. Um, but I also was in your same shoes before where I just didn't understand anything.

And as a matter of fact, my very first council meeting after getting sworn in, um, we had zoning cases that we didn't fully understand. And, uh, Mayor O'Neal was the mayor at the time and she did something unprecedented. She postponed the entire meeting. [clears throat] And I know that kind of rocked staff, but it it happened.

You know, she leaned back. " And she postponed it, you know. Um, so I I'm going to support this, but I will say, uh, there's there are a lot of Hayes. There's HIA reborn.

There's HIA reborn justice movement. There's HR one voice. There's HI promise. There's HI um harmony. And there may be more, you

know, um and like coun um mayor prom said it is it is very hard to get a a a common understanding because there are individuals in here tonight that are saying, you know, hey, this is we don't need to move forward. Or there are some folks that are saying there's corruption or there is colluding, there's this and there's that. I know the work that staff put in. I know the work that we the previous council put in and and making sure that there was an investment back into this community.

Um I also know that um and madam um clerk I should be being time right now so but put it on just a minute. Um but I just you know we at some point we have to move forward and and there there's a lot of there's a lot of you know theoretical approaches to what's happening. You know we talk about history. We talk about urban removal removal urban renewal. Uh but I can tell you one thing. It was this council that

put 10 million on there more than anybody else has in the past and we can't even spend it. I can tell you another thing. There are people who are volunteering on the board to actually who actually are from this area, born and raised that can't really be here tonight because they don't have the luxury of being here. So, at some point, we are going to have to move forward.

There there are some there are some points that were made by my colleague that I agree with because government speak is complicated and so I'm going to support that. But when there I mean there's whenever there's an opportunity to invest in this community, we run into some type of blockade. And I gotta be honest, it's usually the same voices. That's not discounting the voices. And I'm willing to work with any dissenting voice, but I'm looking for those same voices that say no to everything to actually say what because that hasn't been made clear to me. So,

Yeah, I'll come back over here. >> I think it's highly disrespectful to talk about folks not understanding as though it's an intelligence issue and I really think that's like just an just a really inappropriate thing to say up here about a colleague and I think it's really inappropriate to say it about our residents. This isn't a question of people not being able to grasp the like intellectual issues that we're talking about. Folks in the community have answers.

There's contention that the entire plan was created in the community. So, this isn't a this isn't an issue of people not understanding. It's an issue of people not trusting the process and not feeling like that it is transparent. And this is not a not something saying that we've made necessarily poor decisions even with this ARPA funding in the past.

Maybe we have, maybe we haven't. I do think some of the things that we did with ARPA funding in general were really good. But if we are not here committed to listen to a diversity of opinions and

think about how we can build community trust and keep moving at a pace that is respectful and honors the commitment that the community has put into it, then like that's just poor governance on our part. And so that is the request. It's just to slow down and be more transparent. And I really I hear this narrative over and over again and I've called some of you out about it privately, but I really want to say it on the record.

I think I've said it before. I'm going to say it again. This this conversation of oh hatai is so divided and therefore we cannot get anything done. Like what a wild way of putting off any responsibility that we hold as individuals or as people filling these seats that have been so harmful for so many years back onto the people who have been impacted and oppressed by our policy decisions.

I mean that is an unbelievable shift in narrative. And we have communities all over Durham that can't come to consensus on stuff. We

can't ever come to consensus on stuff. It's like we just can't sit here and have this conversation as though that makes hate time not worth investing in or that they are the reason that we have been slow to address the wrongs that we've created. It's really frustrating. We need to be really honest about this conversation.

If we're going to talk about hatai in a way that's dismissive and demeaning, then I don't know why we wouldn't talk about any other neighborhood that has differing opinions in the same way. So, I just want to say that I'm also in support of of handing this back to staff. I'm looking forward to more clarity and hopefully moving on from this item. >> And I'll just say this on the record.

Um, Council Member Burrus, I'm obviously not calling you dumb or any challenge of intellect. I'm actually saying that there this is government speaking. It gets really complicated and I've been in a situation where I didn't fully understand something. I didn't see a lot of clarity and I wanted to push it back as well. I don't go back and forth. Council member Cook, please.

Please don't do that. I'm not calling anyone dumb. I'm not challenging anyone's intellect and please don't gas me. Council member Wrist, >> I was just going to ask on a timeline.

>> That That's all. I just I'm trying to get us to a place so we can keep us moving. Sorry, Council Member. That's all.

>> So So let's be clear. There's no silver bullet here, right? There's been decades of disinvestment in hay tai take decades to address this right. This is a down you all before I down my mic's going out.

Yeah. So it's not council if we're going to do this a clear timeline. One of the things I hear from citizens all the time is like how come things take so long in government right sort of bottleneck stuff right? So what we're doing here, we're slowing things down. And that may be what this council chooses to do. We have to understand that by doing by doing this,

we're slowing things down again, right? That means that investment is not happening. That may be the right choice, but we just got to be clear. We're slowing things down.

So before we get to the motion to restate it, um I just would like to ask that if you have any questions, please submit those by Friday at 5:00 p. Eastern Standard Time so I can make sure it gets over to our city manager's office in a timely manner. And I do want to the mayor pro Tim's point just discuss a timeline as we can bring this back and have it on the agenda. >> Um so I guess it's a question for the clerk.

>> Oh staff, sorry. >> It may be a challenge to answer tonight only because the the critical role that I believe the CDC board needs to really be the ones who come before the council. They are, again, I want to reiterate, they're the ones who are uh administering the program. Um, so our staff will follow up with them immediately to express council's interest in bringing them forward. I'm I if staff has a conjecture about what the

timeline on bringing them forward might look like, I'm happy for staff to offer that, but uh I would want to acknowledge that without the CDC board present this evening that that we may not be able to answer that tonight. I'm happy to get that information as quickly as possible, send it out to council electronically if they prefer. >> That that suffices. Um, so with that, I'd like to make a motion that we refer this item back to staff for further consideration.

>> Second. >> It's a motive proply second. Madam clerk, please open the vote. All right.

Please close the vote. >> And the motion passes unanimously. >> All right. Thank you.

Colleagues, are you experiencing any type of uh restarts or reboots on your mic? >> Not right now. >> Okay. And uh I know you keep going out.

Council member Ris, if we can um mine reboot it, too. So maybe Okay. All

right. The next one's 14. All right. Uh, next item.

Interlocal agreement reauthorizing the dorm bicycle and pedestrian advisory council. Do I have Richard Davis? I'm sorry. Oh, yeah.

That was We did your motion. So, just to be clear, we voted to move it back so we don't have to address it. >> Correct. >> All right.

Uh, do I have a Richard Davis? No, I have him in person. All right. Uh, colleagues, I'll entertain a motion to resolve that the city manager be authorized to negotiate and execute an interlocal cooperation agreement with Durham County to reauthorize the Durham Bicycle and Pedestrian Advisory Commission.

>> So moved. >> Second. >> It's been moved and properly seconded. Matter of clerk, please vote.

Oh. Um, who am I missing? >> Six. >> All right, let's let's do this.

Madam clerk, I'm going to call for a um a hand vote. >> Oh, okay. Never mind. Please close the vote.

>> And the motion passes unanimously. >> All right. Next is uh Okay. Public hearings.

All right. 22 21 20. All right. So, uh, based on 212, uh, I'm going to revert the order, colleagues, on these. Uh we're going to start with item number 22. Consolidated annexation Trenton Road Assimil [clears throat]

Ready for the staff report. Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Cavayo, and honorable council members. Good evening. I am Payton Burgess with the Planning and Development Department and I am happy to be here with you tonight.

99 acres and located at 453, 459, 4517, 4607, and 46011 Trenton Road. This annexation petition is not contiguous to the primary corporate limits, but is contiguous to an existing satellite. As part of this annexation petition, the applicant is not seeking a change in the underlining zoning district of residential suburban 20. A direct translational zoning is one in which the existing county zoning is translated to the identical city zoning district upon

the annexation of the property into the city limits. A translational zoning does not include a development plan and any future development may proceed according to what the zoning would allow. The properties are currently designated established residential on the place type map. The proposed residential suburban 20 zoning is generally consistent with the designated use shown on the place type map.

If the proposed zoning is approved, there will be no change to the place type designation of established residential. Thank you. Staff and the applicant are available for any questions. >> Thank you.

You've heard the staff report. Colleagues, are there any technical questions or comments to staff? All right. At this time, I'll declare this public hearing open.

>> How much time do you think you need? >> Three minutes. >> Three minutes. Put five minutes on the clock, please.

>> Good evening, Mr. Mayor, Mayor Prom, members of council. Pam Porter with TMTLA Associates. landscape architecture

and land planning firm in Durham. And with me tonight is Gary Wallace who is with the homebuilder B. Wallace Design and Construction. Thank you Payton for the overview.

Um just to quickly recap the property uh which is five existing parcels located along Trenton Road is approximately a total of 17 acres and includes three existing homes. The adopted place type map for this location is established residential. All five lots are currently zoned RS20 and will will remain RS20 if this annexation is approved. No reszoning is proposed as part of this request.

If approved, the annexation would allow these lots to connect to city water and sewer. The proposed development is fully consistent with the current zoning district. The plan is to create an additional six single family lots going from 5 to 11. So there will ultimately be eight more homes.

So for 11 total homes of the three existing and the staff report notes up to 33 units could be constructed if this annexation is approved. This is correct under the normal RS20 development rules. The

2 acres per lot for a dwelling to be constructed. This means that with the deed restriction in place, the total number of units that could be constructed is up to 14, but the current plan in place is 41. And just to note, city the city does not regulate deed restrictions, but it is important to mention the total number of dwelling units that could be permitted here with the deed restriction. It's much less than what could be developed under the RS20 zoning district.

And B Wallace uh design and construction is a woman-owned design build firm that will be building the homes similar to the seven homes on the end of uh Milh Hill Lane in the Trenton neighborhood. And we received unanimous support from the planning commission at their November 12th meeting. and we hope to gain your support tonight as well. And thank you for the consideration of our request and both myself and Gary are here for any questions you may have.

Thank you. >> Thank you. I don't have any speakers signed up for

this item. So therefore, I'll declare the public hearing closed and back before the council. Are there any questions? All right, that been said, I'll entertain a motion to adopt an ordinance annexing Trenton Road Trenton Road assemblage into the city of Durham and to authorize the city manager to enter into a utility extension agreement with ME LLC.

Second move second. Uh, madam clerk, please open the vote. Please cast a vote. >> And the motion passes unanimously. >> All right. And I'll entertain a motion to adopt an ordinance amending the unified development ordinance by taking property out of the residential suburban 20 false Jordan district B wershed protection overlay major transportation corridor I40 overlay county jurisdiction and establishing the same as residential

suburban 20 false Jordan district B wershed protection overlay major transportation corridor I40 overlay city jurisdiction. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Please open the vote.

Madam clerk, please close the vote. >> And the motion passes unanimously. >> And I'll entertain a motion to adopt a consistency statement as required by North Carolina General Statute section 160D-605. >> Move to adopt consistency.

>> Second. >> It's been moved and probably second. Madam clerk, please open the vote. >> Please close the vote.

>> And the motion passes unanimously. >> Thank you. Item number 21, zoning map change, Andrews Chapel Apartments. >> Ready for the staff report?

Sorry. >> Mayor Williams, Mayor Pro Tim Cavayo, and honorable council members. Good evening. I'm Payton Burgess with the Planning and Development Department, and I'm happy to be here with you tonight. A request for a zoning map change has been

83 836 acres and located at 1029 Andrews Chapel Road. The current zoning is residential suburban 20. 680. The applicant is proposing to reszone the property to allow up to 60 multifamily dwelling units and at least 1,000 square ft of space to be used for office and or public and civic uses.

The properties are currently designated mixed residential neighborhood on the place type map. 680 zoning is generally consistent with the designated place type. Thank you. Staff and the applicant are available for any questions.

>> Thank you. Are there any uh questions for staff? >> All right. Uh yeah, Council Member Cook. >> Um I have two questions. The first and this I'm sure you're going to be able to answer this, but um is what is the benefit of limiting to write in and write out pathways?

I am going to defer to >> Erlene Thomas on that one. >> Great. >> Good evening. Erlene Thomas, Planning and Development Department.

So, that access point was restricted to right in, right out only due to his proximity to the roundabout. And we want to um limit conflicts um being so close to the roundabout. Can you just explain a little bit more why that does that? >> The benefit of the right in right out and what it does to traffic.

>> So it it restricts lefts out of the site and lefts into the site. >> So you >> Yeah. I just like how does it help the flow of traffic? I mean I I literally understand what right and left are, but I just I'm >> How does it help?

Can you just explain like how it affects if we don't have left turns? We still have people moving that direction. What What does it do to traffic?

>> You do you don't have the conflicts of the flea free flow movement that's that's coming out of the roundabout and then people waiting to turn left into or out. It just sets up um conflict points and increases the ris risk of crashes. >> Okay. Thank you.

And then my next question is not yours, but are elevators not required in buildings that have multiple stories? No, there would not be required in all buildings that have more than one story. >> Is there a story requirement at which that elevator is takes place? And can you tell me what it is?

>> I'm not sure if that requirement off the top of my head. >> Okay. At any point if y'all get it, I would love to know. Those are all my questions.

Thank you. >> Thank you. All right. How much time do you think you need?

Uh, mayor, I think I need about two and a half minutes and my uh, client and friend Jasmine Lubad needs about I'm sorry. Five minutes total. I would need two and a half. Jasmine need two and a half. >> All right. Seven minutes, please.

>> Good evening. Oh, I'm sorry. This public hearing open, sir. Great.

Mayor Williams, Mayor Proen Cabierro, members of the city council. I'm Patrick Biker. I live at 2614 Stewart Drive. I'm an attorney with Morning Star Law Group and I'm here tonight representing Seerserve LLC.

The members of Seerserve are a wonderful young married couple, Jasmine and Emad Lubad. This is their first real estate development project and I have to say it is great to see young local talent jumping into the deep end to take on this type of real estate development. Jasmine and Imod have put together a great local team with civil consultants as their engineers and Gateway Building Company as their contractor as they are both fine local Durham based companies. This section of the city of Durham is in Wake County and I personally worked on the initial annexation of the city into Wake County about 12 years ago. We kicked off the development in this area with the Harris Teter anchored shopping center at Glenwood Avenue and TWW Alexander Drive. As you can see from this slide, the parcel we are

considering tonight is kind of an infill site since it's located very close to other multifamily developments. In our recently adopted comprehensive plan, a key component is creating the 15minute community. 8 acres relates to the other developments in the vicinity. The Harris Teter that I worked on about 10 years ago is less than a third of a mile away to the south as you can see on this slide.

So along with a great grocery store, there are restaurants, other retail services, a Wake Med facility, and a bus stop for GoDorm Route Two. They're all about a 15-inute walk from this site. As Durham needs new housing supply, it is important to look at the existing zoning for Jasmine and Neimod's property. As you can see on this slide, it is RS10. 8 acres into about seven single family lots and use the buy zoning and not have to go through any public hearings. I would be remiss if I did not point out that Immod already

already has a very successful career as the owner and operator of the International Delights restaurant on 9inth Street near Duke East campus. Immad's father started International Delights over 30 years ago and so is a second generation owner of this outstanding restaurant. I also want to highlight that EOD went to Riverside High School and that again reinforces how this is a Durham homegrown initiative. 8 acres.

And to its credit, our team has put together a development plan that is in compliance with 15 out of 18 applicable comprehensive plan policies. That is a strong achievement. In closing, it's my privilege to turn the microphone over to Jasmine Lubad. Jasmine will share more of the team's background and her vision for creating new housing that is targeted at serving our nation's veterans since that type of housing is in very high demand, especially in central North Carolina.

After you hear from Jasmine, our team will be happy to answer any questions. We respectfully ask for your approval. Thank you. >> Good evening, Mayor Williams.

Council members, thank you for allowing us to be here tonight. My husband, Emad, and I are incredibly grateful to be here. Reaching this point represents nearly two years of hard work, collaboration, and determination to bring our vision to life. Together, we bring different strengths and experiences, but share one purpose, building communities that thrive.

We see ourselves not just as developers, but as local partners invested in Durham's long-term success. Our goal for this project is to create a house create housing that's more than just physical structures. It's a place designed to foster stability, opportunity, and connection. Every decision we've made, from design to local partnerships, has been guided by that commitment. Emad is a proud Durham

native whose family has served the city for more than three decades through International Delights Restaurant, a place that has always reflected the spirit of community and belonging. My own journey began in the United States Marine Corps where I learned the values of service, accountability, and perseverance. Those same principles now shaped my work in real estate, housing advocacy, and now multifamily development. My own journey is just beginning, and our work has always been rooted in Durham.

This is our home, where we live, where we plan to raise our children, where we invest our time, our energy, and our resources. Our hope is that this project continues to contribute to the city's thoughtful growth while honoring the people in the neighborhoods that make Durham so special. Thank you for your time, your consideration, and for allowing local families like ours the opportunity to contribute to Durham's growing success and well-being. Thank you.

Thank you. [cough and clears throat] I don't have any more speakers. Uh so I'm going to declare this public hearing closed and back before the council. Do any of my colleagues have any questions.

I'm going to start with council member wrist and then just go down to down the line. >> Go ahead. >> Thank um this is a question for Mr. Biker or the other developer.

Either one. Um I seem to recall I I like this. This is a great infill project. um really appreciate bringing this forward.

Um there was a reference to sort of serving veterans and I want to make sure I understand what what that looks like. >> Yeah, I'm sure Jasmine may have something to add, but what was uh that was discussed at the planning commission uh council member and the text commitment that grew out of that uh give and take with the planning commission was to uh have a text commitment regarding um office uh civic space within the building. and our interaction with veterans is that they really need that type of a a private space with access to computer printer and then somebody like Jasmine who's a listening

ear who understands what their needs are. So um that's the text commitment that was worked out with the planning commission that'll be implemented by Jasmine and her colleagues. >> And so what does it so so what's the veterans component look like be be I mean are you sort of marketing this to veterans or how does that >> Yeah. Yeah.

So it's if you look at the bottom of this slide, you can see that there's a homes for heroes real estate specialist and and she's also on the board of directors of empowerment. So it's it's and she's a housing liaison for the uh district military advisory board. So it's really using her u real life experience uh to assist her fellow veterans. >> But again, so it's more more of a from a marketing perspective.

There's no there's no special I mean there there'll be this this um the commercial space with some space for services to be determined but it's not this is not a supportive housing model like that where >> yeah it's not like that. >> Okay. So it's just offering that as a as a inducement to folks who may want to move there. >> Yep. It's to help. What what we've heard

from veterans was what they really need is one a person who can give them individualized attention and then access to um computer, internet, and a printer. Just nuts and bolts to get through the programs that are available to help our nation's veterans with their housing needs. >> Well, that's great. And then the next question is um certainly we need a range of housing options in Durham.

Veterans need a range of housing options including affordable housing. I know there's no commitment to affordable housing. Can you say more about like the price point to make this to to sort of >> I think we're too early in the process to really know that, but obviously we're trying to value engineer it as carefully as we can. The the amazing thing about this project is not only did EOD go to Riverside High School, our engineer went to Riverside High School, and so we're we're so early in the process, it's very hard to speculate what that would be, but obviously Jasmine is incentivized to make it as affordable as possible using the programs that are there to help our veterans.

>> Gotcha. Thanks. >> Yes, sir. Council member Cook.

>> Um, thank you. Thank you. Council member Rrist actually asked a lot of the

questions that I was going to ask. And um, I think that this it was kind of similar to the commissioners is how I feel, which is that like we believe that y'all are going to do a good service in this space. I can't speaking to you. Hi.

Um, uh, I believe that y'all are going to do a good service in this space. I just, for me, I'm not seeing how it like in how the, um, commitments sort of reflect that. Um, and so I'm just I'm curious about the conversation that happened with staff about the civic use building because I know that there was like quite a bit of conversation that was going on and >> it seems to me very vague the language that was agreed upon. I was just wondering if you could fill me in on how that conversation went. Uh, I think it was an outgrowth of the discussion with the planning commission and working with the staff and identifying again in a building that hasn't been fully designed yet what would be appropriate in terms of creating a space that would work uh so that veterans uh feel comfortable uh have access to the services they need and are able to uh access um the

programs. Jasmine may have, she would certainly know more about it than I do, but uh there's definitely numerous programs available to help our nation's veterans, but what is needed is to get back to not to repeat myself, but is getting back to somebody who specializes with that uh in that space, somebody like Jasmine, and then providing the resources to our veterans so that they have free access without time constraints. They can just sit there. If it takes them an hour to fill out an application, that's great.

If it takes them four hours to fill out an application, that's great. That's why we're providing the space. >> Okay. Yeah.

I mean, I think when I read office in slash civil use and and this was brought up by the planning commission, it's like yes, there's a leasing office at an apartment complex. >> Um, >> do we like how do we know that that's actually going to be like accessible and used by folks? >> Um, Jasmine's the developer of it and you can go down there and see her anytime you want. Yeah, but I guess it doesn't carry over if they choose to sell or anything like that.

>> No, of course. I mean, there are no >> um >> there are no guarantees. I I appreciate that. I mean, god forbid they have a health problem or something happens, that would be terrible.

>> Yes. >> But at this age, they're fully committed to >> normally our commitments run with the land, right? And so that's kind of like I think [clears throat] what people were getting at, which is that like it doesn't feel like this is going to run with the land. And so it's just a an interesting question.

I appreciate. >> Um, is there are these going to be for rent? >> Yes. >> And is there I know you said previously that you felt like it was too small, but have y'all gone back to see if there's any um ability to do some of these units at affordable?

>> At this point in time, we don't have any uh idea of how the financing is going to work out for uh constructing um what is a tight site. This is a pretty high density on a pretty small site. And so that tends to drive up costs. And so it's very until we get through the architectural um process and obtain our financing,

it's really impossible to state what um exactly what monthly rents will be except that our our team is obviously committed to value engineering the site so that it's as cost effective as possible. >> Okay. I know that we have the um the elevator commitment. Mhm.

>> Are there any other ADA commitments that you all have been able to make in this apartment building? >> I think that really was the one that we thought made the most sense. Obviously, it's more expensive than having a stairway, but obviously with our veterans, we have to have an elevator. Um, and so I think that's where we are right now in terms of the process that we're going through in terms of the building hasn't been designed yet, but once it is, um, it'll have an elevator and it'll be um, configured so that veterans have access to that civic and office space that I referred to earlier. >> Okay. And then, um, any commitments that y'all are able to make around green

building? again because of the cost factors involved. That's something that I'm sure Jasmine and I care about that deeply, but at this point in time, those programs carry a carry a decent price tag and so it' be hard for us to commit commit to that at this time. >> Okay.

Thank you. Those are my questions. >> Appreciate it. >> Um, Council Member Copac or no, Council Member Baker.

>> Yeah. Uh thank you for uh [clears throat] bringing this forward to us. Um yeah, I think some of my questions have been asked as well. Uh so so the non-residential and I always like to see non-residential included in residential uh buildings.

I like to see vertical mixeduse. Um so is this just a leasing office? Is that is that what's uh anticipated here? And as >> No, it would be more than that. Uh, Council Member Baker, it would be a

space that would be available to veterans for counseling, advising, applications, and having access to uh the federal programs designed to help them. So, it's I would say in that regard, it's a civic use. >> Okay. Okay.

It's just not uh it's just not part of the commitment. It's just very broad as a commitment. >> Right. Well, I mean it's there could be other, for example, we have access to a lot of good food at International Delights.

There could be an internal cafe for people. We didn't want to restrict it. Uh uh just because we want to create a welcoming space for veterans and that that could be something that works, but >> so it'll just be a a minimum of 1,000 square feet like on the first floor, >> correct? >> For Melon residential.

It'll just kind of be like a storefront. Yeah. Or it's being intern The building hasn't been designed yet, but it'd be intern obviously being internal, but it would be one of the main entrances.

Correct. >> Okay. Like accessible from the sidewalk. >> Yes, sir.

>> Okay. Um >> that's correct. >> Okay. I guess it doesn't have to be because it's not a commitment.

>> All right. Well, um appreciate Yeah, I love international delights. Uh no ketchup allowed. >> We appreciate that.

>> Yeah. >> Can't beat the bacon. All right. Thank you, >> Council Member Copek.

>> Most of my questions were covered. I'll just say that I appreciate the local developer connection. Um uh so thank you for your service and for the work you're trying to do and the population you're trying to serve. Um I also note that we're more accustomed to the commitments being um you know in the text commitments so it can move with the land.

So I'm kind of processing that. Um but I I do appreciate um some of the positive elements of this case. Thank you. Council member Burrus, did you have any questions?

>> Um, Mr. Mayor, do you want to take over? You want me to keep going? >> I'll just finish it up.

>> Okay. Thank you. U, there's no more

questions. 680. >> So, moved. >> Second.

>> Have a motion, a second. Madam clerk, please open the vote. Please close the vote. Almost.

And the motion passes unanimously. >> Thank you. Uh, could I please get a motion to adopt a consistenc consistency statement as required by NCGS section 160D- 605? >> So moved >> motion.

Could I get a second? >> Second. >> Thank you, madam clerk. Could you please open the vote?

>> Please close the vote. >> And the motion passes unanimously. >> Thank you. Uh our next item is item number 20, consolidated annexation Britmore. We have a variety of speakers.

Uh I will go to our online speakers first. >> Staff report. Thank you. I'm like let's go.

It's 9:52. Hello, >> Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Cabo, and honorable council members. Good evening. I am Payton Burgess with the Planning and Development Department, and I am still happy to be here with you tonight.

Um, I would like to state for the record that all planning department hearing items have been advertised and noticed in accordance with state and local law and affidavit of all notices are on file in the planning department for the cases you've heard tonight. 668 668 acres and located at 8118, 8120, 8122, 8200, 8204, and 8210 Fington Mill Road. This annexation petition is not contiguous to the primary corporate limits, but is contiguous to an existing

satellite. The current zoning is residential rural. 313 with the textual development plan to allow up to5 town houses and single single family homes. The properties are currently designated mixed residential neighborhood on the place type map.

313 zoning is generally consistent with the designated use shown on the place type map. If the proposed zoning is approved, there will be no change to the place type designation of mixed residential neighborhood. Thank you. Staff and the applicant are available for any questions.

>> Thank you. Um, council colleagues, does anyone have any questions for staff? >> Okay, I'm going to go ahead and declare the public hearing open. Uh, I'm going to go first to online speakers if Oh, go ahead, Patrick. I'm late. [laughter] >> Um, Mayor Prom, if I could have about 10 minutes, that'd be great.

>> Okay. Um, good evening, Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Cabierro, members of the city council. I'm Patrick Biker. I live at 2614 Stewart Drive.

I'm an attorney with Morning Star Law Group and I'm here tonight representing Trioint Homes. With us tonight are our team leader, Mandy Hy with Trioint, and Tim Cyvers, the president of CUNY, our land planning and engineering firm for this mixed residential neighborhood that we are calling Britmore. At the outset and as noted in your staff report, we are pleased that this resoning complies with 23 out of 27 applicable policies in our comp plan. This is a very strong degree of compliance in my experience.

I wish to emphasize our commitment that impervious surface will will be limited to no more than 50%. Accordingly, half of this site's acreage will be green space, tree cover, open space, and undisturbed. That's a strong commitment since the UDO allows up to 70% impervious surface in this section of Durham. I want to emphasize that there are no wetlands or stream buffers or other sensitive environmental features on the Britmore site.

Nevertheless, in response to a concern raised to the planning commission, our team committed to a 50-foot undisturbed area with the exception of UDO required stubouts along the western edge of Britmore to serve as a wildlife corridor. In regard to such environmental concerns, the Britmore proposal that follows our place type map is far better than the byite development of 37 estate homes with a septic field with septic fields in the Jordan Lake protected area. It is important for the council to know that there is an established market for multi-million dollar estate homes in this section of Durham as evidenced by all the recent sales of single family homes in the down neighborhoods in the Downs neighborhood that are over $1 million as reflected on the Zillow website. 75 million. The last um lastly, the most recent home built in the Downs has an appraised value appraised value in excess of $5 million. As you can see on the upper right corner of this slide, keep in mind these homes pay county

taxes only. I find it admirable that Trioint has not taken the byright estate home route. 5 million to city tax revenues over a 10-year period. Younger Durites have been frozen out of home buying in this section of Durham, and I believe Britmore will be an opportunity many of our younger Durham residents will be excited about.

When we look at Britmore in relation to our adopted comprehensive plan, a key component and perhaps the dominant theme is densify inside the urban growth boundary. 87 units per acre. In addition, Montlair has only one housing type, single family detached, and that is enshrined in Montlair's

declaration of restrictive covenants. 313 units per acre, and we are providing a combination of single family homes and town homes to diversify the housing inventory in this section of Durham. Next, I want to highlight the traffic information on page five of your staff report in regard to traffic. This proposal increases traffic generation from this 27 acre site by 55 trips in the AM peak and 74 trips in the PM peak.

City of Durham transportation staff has confirmed that Fington Mill Road has sufficient capacity for this new development. Furthermore, there are fewer trips on Fington Mill Road today than were recorded by NC DOT both in 2017 and 2019. It is important to note that the current traffic on Fington Mill Road is almost entirely being generated by residents of Chattam County in neighborhoods like Governor's Club, Governor's Village, and Carolina Meadows. Traffic also comes from the Amberly neighborhood in northwest Kerry that straddles the Wake

Chadam County line. From our community outreach and given the background pass by traffic just mentioned, we understand there is concern from Montlair residents about the prospect of cutthrough traffic upon the completion of Shore Crest Road down to Fington Mill Road. Accordingly, we proposed a four-way stop sign in the middle of the Britmore development, but unfortunately that proposal did not fly with the city's transportation staff. Tripoint is happy to reinstate this four-way stop as a text commitment if it is requested by the council. If this commitment were were reinstated, any traffic trying to get from Frington Mill Road to Bab Chapel Road would need to go through five stop signs as opposed to the existing one stop sign on Mil Chapel Road. If a commuter today from Chattam County was going to cut through Montlair to get to UNC to be a good neighbor, we are you we are offering a text commitment that all construction related traffic shall be required to enter Britmore off of Fington Mill Road well away from the Montlair neighborhood, which is

something you can see on this slide. When Montlair was approved, it was clear at that time that this acreage to the south would be developed at some point in the future. Here on this slide is the stubout of Shore Crest Road in Montlair that was stubbed out to the Britmore site. 07 that areas adjacent to Montlair are subject to further development and expansion.

I would be remiss if I did not point out that there also is sewer infrastructure stubbed out here as you can see where you see on this slide and that sewer has capacity to serve the 27 acres we are discussing tonight. Britmore will be served by gravity sewer. No lift stations will be required. And the construction of the waterline extension that will create a water loop through Britmore and then along Fairington Mill Road and then up Mil Chapel Road should improve water pressure in the Montlair neighborhood as a community benefit. Just to show how the Britmore development was anticipated, this slide shows an aerial view of where

the water where the road and sewer connection will tie into the existing city of Durham infrastructure. Next, I wish to refer to a recent statewide study done by about North Carolina's housing shortage. According to Bowen National Research, in a study commissioned by our state chamber of commerce, Durham needs 15,293 forale homes to meet the demand for that type of housing over the 2024 2029 time frame. I wish to direct your attention to the bottom center of the chart on this slide. This 27 acre property in southwest Durham which has good access to all the jobs at UNCC hospital which was designated mixed use mixed residential neighborhood on the future place type map which has no sensitive environmental features on the site has a road stub out with water and sewer infrastructure that was put in place about a decade ago and sufficient road capacity adjacent to the site that exemplifies an ideal location for addressing that 15,000 unit forale

housing shortfall that we are looking at right now. To wrap up, Britmore contains both town houses and single family homes. Unlike most of the resonings over the past 20 years, Britmore also contributes affordable housing to help address Durham's housing supply problem that I just referred to a moment ago. And we are providing 10% of the single family homes to have a firstf floor bedroom.

This evening, we extend that text commitment to include a firstf floor kitchen as well in those homes. So there will be age and mobility inclusion in Britmore if we are fortunate enough to receive your approval. Our team also has worked hard to focus on sustainability and we are doing that through Trip Point's Living Smart program and we will commit on the record to include conduit for all single family homes so that every home buyer has the option to install rooftop solar panels and provide a circuit for EV charging uh in every garage which is in furtherance of policy 59 in our comprehensive plan to encourage private investment in electric

vehicle infrastructure. In closing, this is a strong proposal that hits the mark on 23 out of 27 applicable comprehensive plan policies. For all these reasons, we respectfully ask for your approval. Our team will be happy to answer any questions.

We very much appreciate your time tonight. >> Thank you. Sorry. All right.

So, uh we will go to our speakers and I'll start with my online speakers first. All right. Uh Patrick Mark, I'm sorry. Mark Patrick, can you hear me?

>> Yes, I can. Can you hear me? >> Yes. Welcome.

We have three minutes. >> Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Mayor Williams and Durham City Council members

for the opportunity to raise a point of concern about the proposed Britmore development. My name is Mark Patrick and I live in the Montlair neighborhood that has planned to direct directly connect both road and sewer with the proposed Britmore development. First slide, please. I have two slides if that's possible.

Yeah, go. Yep. Go ahead. >> Okay, great.

Thank you. Um, so the first uh two slides are images from previous public meetings and you may recall we just saw uh similar images a few minutes ago regarding this development showing the Britmore and Montlair road and sewer connections through Shore Crest Road as shown there. Um and basically it's um just showing that top one top image is just the overview and then the image we we saw this goes out of shore crest and how

that shoreline is going to be uh would be connected going down further down short crest. The second slide please. I can't see it on my screen so I assume you can see it. >> Yes.

>> Okay. Thank you. Perfect. Okay.

Four images here. Uh the second slide simply shows several perspectives that unequivocally document the appreciable high and steep drop off literally within a few feet of the end of the paved section of short crest road under which the sewer connection from British proposed. Recall that in the first slide that picture that was um shown in my slides as well as just a few minutes ago few minutes ago does not show that drop off to this point. I've heard during um this and several public meetings concerning Montlair's sewer connection uh quote quote just what we heard a few minutes ago will be served with gravity flow unquote with no other detail

provided. This thought has always puzzled me since my home has a line of sight right down Shore Crest Road knowing that water and sewage do not run uphill on its own. Council members, in closing, I hope that in consideration of the many speakers tonight and during the previous public meetings who have highlighted a broad range of negative impacts about the proposed Britmore development that you will vote no to Britmore. Thank you for your time and consideration.

>> Thank you. Next speaker, Christopher Peekham. Christopher, can you hear me? >> Hi folks, am I audible?

>> Welcome. You have three minutes. >> Thank you. Good evening, folks. I'm Chris Peekham, president of the Montlair HOA and my address is on file. Uh this evening, we've heard from the developer about the reasons why we should accept their proposal to develop more housing

units than currently zoned. They say that it will help us with our housing shortage. They say it will provide affordable and accessible housing. They also have in their proposal that they will make an investment in Durham schools.

This all sounds good until you dig in a little deeper. Housing shortage. There are 3 to 4,000 housing units being sold or under construction within 3 miles of this area and another 3 to 4,000 under re review. So, their development does not add to this substantially.

Affordable and accessible housing. This development will only give us six more affordable homes and 12 more accessible homes. And they will be two and a half miles from the nearest bus stop without adequate walking or biking paths to get there. Investment in public schools.

Their development will give us approximately 20 new students, each of which is projected to cost us over $5,000 per year in operating costs. They want to pay us $10,500. So they basically just want to cover two students for a year. So what do we get from this development? You'll hear much more about this from the other speakers

that follow me, but let me offer this. According to the city manager's costbenefit analysis, we get a run rate of about 300K per year starting 3 to four years from now. But this is only about 4100ths of 1% of the city's budget, far from the city's policy on annexation that requires a substantial benefit to the community. Instead, the community gets 771 more vehicles on our roads daily, causing more backups and accidents at Frington Mill and Barbie Chapel or at Stage Coach.

Or maybe they're cutting through Britmore in Montclair to avoid these intersections. Hopefully, they avoid our residents as well. They will definitely be advancing the decay on the roads and on an already crumbling bridge that you'll hear about. We will also get additional impact to our natural areas, to our wildlife, and to our very own drinking water.

And you'll hear more about that soon. And finally, you're going to get the eyeire of a civic voting community because increasing housing density in this area is simply going to cause more harm than good. Please vote no.

>> Thank you. Next, I have Javiera Caballero. >> Oh, sorry. All right.

In person. So I will call up a series of names five at a time. First Julie Mc Julie Mcccleintoch followed by Eleanor Sanders followed by Barry Saunders, Chelsea Cook and Elizabeth Bby Moore. >> In that order.

Good evening, Mayor Williams and council members. I'm Julie Mcccleintoch and my address is on file. I oppose the resoning along with my neighbors. To begin, we don't have enough information about the project to determine whether the zoning changes really warranted.

This project relies on a textual development plan chosen by the applicant which omits key details. As a result, it's challenging for us who travel these roads daily to comment or guess the contents of the final plan. We don't understand how a rural property with limited infrastructure and transit will function. The planning commission also lacked confidence in this project and did not recommend it.

The development plan so far is a mixed residential project comprising unspecified types of homes and town homes. uh do we know where they will be placed? Do we know where the streams and buffers are located? What is the actual traffic impact?

How much truly affordable housing is there? What happens if the zoning is approved? And staff finds impossible to fit 115 units on only 13 usable acres without infringing on

stream buffers. It will be too late for the city to revert the property to rural residential without the owner's approval. And that won't happen. The future of this area's mobility is in your hands because you determine the increased traffic incrementally project by project.

Road capacity is insufficient now to accommodate additional cars and this is unlikely to change. The Army Corps of Engineers will continue to limit transit improvements to protect its primary mission and that is the Jordan Lake watershed and our drinking water supply. We call upon you, the city, the Durham City Council to provide a manageable framework for future growth and deny a zoning change for this property. Thank you very much. Hello.

Good evening, council members. Um, I'm Eleanor Saunders. I'm moved every time I come here, so thank you for your work and thoughtfulness. I live in Orange County right now, but I return a few times a week to my childhood home in the Downs neighborhood in Durham County.

Um, to begin with, I'm a 38-year-old physician with privilege and without children, and I feel priced out of Durham, where I grew up, and went to Durham Jordan High School. Um, but that doesn't mean that I support short-sighted development. And my parents bought their one and a half story, 1600 foot house for 150,000 in 1991. So, the multi-million dollar bias doesn't tell the whole story of houses in the Downs or that I grew up around um when a lot of these were open lots.

So, this map that um I'm showing you comes from the comes from the Durham GIS server. It shows topo lines in orange and wetlands in this aqua color. So, that's not all water, but that's wetlands. The Britmore parcel is a red square um being covered up by the teleprompter, but in the lower left. So,

Interstate 40 is this yellow line um from the upper left to the lower right and route 54 uh you can see across east to west. Um but what I want most want you to appreciate is how wet and and how low this far corner of the county is and how narrow the north south ridges of higher ground are that support two-lane rural roads and dwellings. All of us who have lived there or live there feel our proximity to the water. The Britmore parcel in red sits in a protective zone for Jordan Lake.

It adjoins the critical zone where dense development can't happen. Drainage into Jordan is mostly via Little Creek to the east and a tiny bit via Morgan Creek to the west. Both creeks are already overburdened. Um and the lake arms that they flow into already bear too high a nutrient load. Generally development pressure on Jordan on Durham Creeks draining into North Jordan Lake is intensifying. Development in sensitive locations will degrade water quality.

Okay. Uh all new developments bring it new impervious surfaces, leaking vehicles, and landscaping fertilizers all contribute nutrient and toxin pollution to lake water that serves drinking and recreation uses. And here are some of the utrophic or nutrient overburdened conditions that presently occur throughout the shallow northern arms of the lake. Although Britmore developers proposed to limit imperous surfaces to 50% and to catch drainage in a pond, 13 acres of new cement and development in this appropriately rurally zoned place that's simply too much for the ecosystem to bear.

Thank you. Council members, thank you for hearing us tonight. I'm Barry Saunders from KBEC

Drive in Durham County. This is zoomed in from the map Ellaner just showed you. The Britmore parcel is in the Jordan Lake FJB protective zone and adjoins the critical zone. Drainage into Jordan, as she said, is mostly via Little Creek to the east, a small bit via Morgan Creek to the west.

NCDEQ classifies both these creeks as protected water supply and sensitive to additional nutrient loads. Yet they and the northern part of Jud Lake are increasingly impaired thanks largely to Durham and Chapel Hill. It seems likely the taxpayers will eventually wind up paying to remediate this someday somehow. The Durham soils map above shows several intermittent streams on the Britmore parcel. This is the UDO required reference. Uh Brit the Britmore team has not submitted any on-site stream

determinations that contravene these streams. The aerial photo below Britmore in red simply highlights the same stream location shown on the soils map. These streams enter parcels of Army Corps Lake buffer outlined in purple and they continue northward. Intermittent streams require will require 100 foot riparian buffers.

These are roughly marked here. Look how buffers restrict what land can be graded and built. One of the streams is already within 100 ft of the Montlair stub road at the Britmore northern boundary. Hard to imagine how that road connection, we've seen images of it, can fail to violate a buffer. Uh that road is aptly named Shore Crest because it's perched 20 feet overlooking and intruding into a stream bed, the buffer of a stream bed. shore crest in view of the streammat [clears throat] map which the developers um have not

referenced in the convenient sparseness of their textual application. Their own schematic of the development is misleading. Streams will limit what developers can build. Only a high proportion of town homes could squeeze 115 units onto 13 acres.

Much better. Far fewer units. much less roof and pavement to limit impacts of this development on sensitive ecosystems and water bodies down slope. Thank you.

Good evening, mayor, mayor prom and city council members. My name is Chelsea Cook and I am a toxicologist and my address is 7624 KBEC Drive in the Downs. Many aspects of the Britmore application do not meet policies for or the objectives of the environment goal for harmonious

and respectful development of the Durham County comprehensive plan. 5 acres that according to the plan I'll show that was shared by the developer will be filled in or it will not be feasible to develop it. There is a report out here we referenced before the landscape analysis for wildlife habitat connectivity in Durham County North Carolina and it's the Durham County itself open space program. Here I want to show that there are um you can see the wildlife habitat areas throughout and how we're talking about right down in this corner. There are many undisturbed areas for which building can be done such as the um two zoning requests previously um put before. So, the DURM comprehensive plan cites policy 79 to protect Durham's most

ecologically sensitive natural areas from impacts of development and policy 81 to protect the most environmentally sensitive portions of the site and create large and contiguous habitats. These policies both come with a designation of D, which are the ones that have the greatest impact on development cases. Here you can see that the high priority habitat that is designated in that open space program runs right through here. This is the the map of the Britmore area.

The existing pond and this corridor that comes through here to connect these high priority areas. According to the plan that was put forth at that initial community meeting by Britain itself, not only would it not protect this, but it would build houses um put in a storm water um control measures retention pond. The tree preservation area is not even included in that high priority area and the town homes would go where the

pond is destroying what current habitat there is. Sorry. The textual submission allows hiding these policies. For example, the the application says that it's not applicable.

There are no identified sensitive natural areas on this site. My previous slide shows that there are no commitment exists to protect or connect these or even acknowledge them. Therefore, I ask please stick to the Durham comprehensive plan to build Durham responsibly. We do not need this type of development in this area, but rather in places like the previous two zoning requests discussed this evening.

So, please do not approve annexing Britmore. Thank you for your attention. And as as [clears throat] Miss Bivby is

getting ready, uh the next five speakers will be James Cohen, Linda Cast Castagliola. All right. Um Holtz Farley, Joe Sagula. Good evening, council members, and I wish you kindness.

I sincerely do. My name is Elizabeth Moore, and my address is on record. I live across the street from this proposed development. And I want to be clear that my concern is not with town homes or future residents. It's about whether this level of density is appropriate for this for this location. The Durham comprehensive plan emphasizes context sensitive development appropriate transitions in density directing higher density housing to areas with adequate infrastructure.

Okay. Can you see that this is actually divided into four Whoops. Okay. This is Orange County.

[snorts] This is Durham County, Wake County, and then down here, Chadam County. Here is the boundaries of these counties. And this arrow points to the development that you're being asked to consider. Do you see this Y shape up here of black, dark green material?

That's considered a wildlife corridor with tree cover and access to water. See how it flows down here through Durham County, the southwest corner, right into I guess you can't see my little arrow there, down into Jordan Lake. At any

rate, the Brill housing proposal is misplaced at this location because of environmentally sensitive site for protecting Jordan Lake drinking water and a Durham County mature oak hickory forest serving as wildlife corridor adjacent to natural heritage area, Morgan Creek and the Little Creek Whed. It's inappropriate fit with surrounding area used for agriculture, recreation, wildlife, and smaller footprint sinker fan small. I need a new tongue. Durham comprehensive plan policies number 83.

Leave wildlife corridors undisturbed. Discourage development that destroys biodiversity. Look at this site. It will look like this. These are the town homes three miles

away. 15 trioint town homes are 20. Oh, I can close this. I don't want to pat my head and rub my tummy at the same time.

I'm John Cowan. I'm the owner of Blue Sun Farm directly across the road from this this uh development. I have 112 acres there with uh horses, sheep, hay. Um we uh we are crit the most highest level of critical Jordan Lake wershed. I don't see how 60 feet away across a road it can be just absolutely okay to do massive development. Um the planning

commission voted unanimously to remove this area from the growth boundary and the city council overrode that. Um the developer has conveniently given you maps that don't show the extent to which this area is thousands of acres of protected waterlands and wetlands and um critical uh and critical wow and critical uh natural habitat. Uh there are two ponds there on opposite sides. Our pond uh is a home to uh hooded morganers, buffalo heads, kingfishers.

We have osprey and we're looking around for bald eagle nest. So that's right across the street from where they want to develop. Um current plans for the Western Water Project park line go directly through this area where they say they're going to somehow uh alleviate the the the traffic. They're going to have hundreds of traffic events coming out directly across from my farm. They want to divert the construction traffic to uh beside my farm, not the

other direction. There have been 40 publicized accidents um at Fington and uh 54. That's been a tremendous problem. The traffic there is horrendous all the time.

Um I've committed myself to run my horse sheep, hay, and honey farm and ensure our vital and growing rural community continues forward forever. This is a community. It's not empty space. This is not an unused area.

Um, this area must be restricted to rural farming and single family homes. The vague proposal here addresses none of the very strong reasons not to develop and would be typical for a simple infill of an urban area. This proposal is going from zero to 1,000 uh destroying our natural resources forever. I've committed my land to the Volunteer Agriculture District for 10 years, joining at least two other VAD properties nearby.

I have 17 employees who work for me. They talk about uh jobs for young people. I hire young people. I have seven homes on my land. I provide

more low-income housing on my farm than they propose already. [clears throat] We raise honeybees and hay, and we produce sheep, a source of meat, to underserved ethnic communities. We have a large equestrian resource center and are employing new North Carolina State agricultural program graduates and students, supporting and teaching the people who will grow your food tomorrow. I'm getting public funding from Durham County soil and water state funding for conservation and improve community water.

But right across the road, the development impacted Jordan Lake would be devastating. Uh it would be demanding a grave risk to the Army Corps to reduce flood control uh with the waterfall impoundments. Thank you.

Okay, there it is. >> Good evening, Mayor Williams, city council members. My name is Linda Castagliola and my home address is on file. The Triangle West Vision Zero Plan is a regional report endorsed by jurisdictions from Durham to Carbbor, making the highlighting of the potential dangers of these local rural roads here even more significant.

The intersections that would be affected by Britmore are all classified as regional high-risk intersections for fatal or injury crashes. I'm sure it wasn't anticipated when these rural roads were laid out that they would be used for such dense developments. It's hard to see in the lowresolution map, but Bab Chapel Road, Farington Road, and Stage Coach Road are shown to be in the top 15% of highest risk for crashes. A development at the density of Britmore

on these rural roads is quite literally an accident waiting to happen. Farington Mill Road is one of the top feed top five speed risk locations in Durham County and is the major road impacted by this development. I direct you to the red circle which indicates the likelihood of a fatal or injury crash in this area. A disconnected walk, bite, skate path will be only along the frontage of the development on Farington Mill Road.

The path would end pretty much directly across the street from Kley Road, making pedestrian, skaters, and cyclists suddenly without designated safe pathways right where the Down's community access is. All it would take is one distracted or careless driver and one pedestrian or cyclist to go beyond the stretch of the path. And well, you figure that one out. Keley Road is the primary access point for the Downs

community. No secondary or public access roads are available for this development. Driving will be the only option for residents to get to work, schools, shopping, recreation, etc. Thus adding more vehicles on already crowded and dangerous rural roads.

Many of the suggested mitigation strategies cannot be implemented since the Army Corps of Engineers has jurisdiction over much of the adjoining area and historically has not given access to expand or make changes. There are no scheduled city of Dorm or NC DOT roadway improvement projects in the area. Thank you. Slow,

slow computer. Sorry. Hello, Mayor Williams and council members. My name is Hulk Farley.

I live on Kley Road. I'm here to address flaws in the Britmore transportation analysis. I've sent each of you a detailed written review. I'll briefly summarize the key points.

This the traffic summary lists. This is in the uh proposal. The traffic summary lists a roadway capacity, latest traffic volume, and traffic added by the project. No guidance is given to how to interpret these numbers.

A casual reader might simply add Britmore traffic to the latest traffic and conclude that the road remains below capacity. That conclusion would be wrong. What is not shown in this traffic summary. What is not shown is the traffic summary uses a Florida DOT manual to determine road capacity. That manual includes a

critical footnote which in plain terms states that level of service D used here for this road type already represents a gridlocked level of service F which is not an acceptable operation. Also the latest traffic volume is old 2023 data. By Britmore's completion in 2029, that latest traffic flow will be six years out of date. Further, the analysis completely ignores ambient traffic growth and cumulative impacts of all the nearby concurrent projects.

Using current NC do traffic data, Fington Mill Road traffic is growing at 7% per year. Continuing this trend shows ambient growth alone will push the road into gridlock by 2028. This projection does not include traffic

from Britain, 15 other nearby housing projects or the commuter traffic from huge new developments in Orange and Chattam counties. In fact, um the developers already pointed out there's a great deal of commuter traffic coming from the south and it comes up Fington Mill Road. In summary, the transportation impact summary makes no effort to estimate realistic future conditions, ignores the cumulative impact of many other concurrent projects, and misrepresents the road capacity. Ambient growth alone will soon gridlock Fair Fington Road, creating serious traffic and safety hazards.

Thank you. >> As Mr. Sigula is coming up, uh the next speakers, Tom Galloway, Bessie Buchanan, Jackie Lambertson, Eddie Williamson, and Larry Tedum.

Good evening, Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Caballero, and council members. Appreciate your patience. It's been quite a night already. My name is Joe Sigula.

I live on Keley Road in the Downs. I'd like to follow up on what Mr. Farley has addressed and explained how Frington Mill Road fits into the larger road network and why traffic in this area cannot be real realistically mitigated. Builtmore is shown here in the center of the map.

Frington Mill Road along with US 15501 and Route 751 have become a major conduit into Durham from the southwest. Alston Frington Mill Road traffic is forced into just three roads. West towards Chapel Hill on Bab Chapel, north towards I40 on Frington Mill on Frington Road, and east towards South Point on Stage Coach Road. There are no alternative through roads.

These three roads already function as busy commuter roads, especially when congestion builds on both 54 and I40. And continued residential development just keeps adding traffic to this already constrained network. If you look at this map, it highlights the land managed by the US Army Corps of Engineers, which provides critical flood control into Jordan Lake, which you've heard about already. These three major intersections fed by Frington Mill are confined by this land.

Congestion at these locations is often severe, and as you've heard, it backs up for more than a half a mile on a regular basis. For more than 30 years, the Army Corps has refused to release land for road expansion. As a result, multiple regional transportation studies working with the

NC DOT have acknowledged that Army Corps approvals are not possible. So, thinking about potential core approvals will certainly not solve this problem. To summarize, Britmore traffic will only add significantly to an already overburdened and constrain constrained road network. And most importantly, emergency service vehicles, which we've heard about, access to this corridor, our homes will be significantly compromised.

And once again, I want to say, let's not forget Fington Mill Road has been documented as one of the top five most dangerous roads in Durham. And for those reasons, I ask you to vote no. Thank you.

Good evening, council members. My name is Tom Galloway and my address is on file. I want to show you two maps. Map number one shows a three-mile radius around Britmore.

Notice the major transportation corridors are on the perimeter, 501 to the west, 54 and I40 to the north, and 751 to the east. Our local roads, including Fington Mill Road, are in the center. The yellow dots show Britmore and Morgan Farm, which are seven miles apart on Fington Mill Road. Map number two zooms in on the extensive environmentally protected land in this corner of southwest Durham County.

Most of the green areas in the center are Army Corps protected lands. Every one of our local roads passes through Army Corps land and is subject to strict oversight. These roads have a finite traffic capacity and are already nearing that capacity. This map also shows 18 housing

developments with nearly 7,400 units that have been advanced since October 22. That map is down here. This the list of those properties is down here if you need to look for I also give you gave you a handout. Nearly all of these developments, if you notice, all of these developments are near the major highway corridors.

There are no developments on our local roads except proposed Britmore and Morgan farm. Our local road infrastructure simply cannot absorb highdensity development. Because our highways are already congested, commuters are increasingly diverting to our local roads. Frington Mill Road is the primary commuter bypass between Durham, Chadam, and Orange counties.

9% from August 24 to August of 25. The projections you just heard reflect ambient growth only. They exclude

development traffic from all of these developments on this map. Yet 3,300 of those units will come online in the next three years, worsening highway congestion and diverting more traffic to our local roads. Because of this, Frington Mill will reach LOSF by 2028. We We can't control commuter behavior, but you can control development growth.

I urge you to deny dense housing developments of any size on our local roads. Our road infrastructure cannot absorb the additional traffic. Please vote no on Britmore. Good evening, Mayor Williams, city council members. My name is Betsy

Buchanan, and my husband and I moved into the Downs a little over 50 years ago. I'm so glad you want to hear more about traffic. For years, Frington Mill was a peaceful country road. Developments grew and traffic increased, and there are certain times of the day now when we can't even leave the Downs.

Britmore's proposed access into Fington Mills directly across from Keley Road is one of the most dangerous curves on the road. To add another several hundred cars to that traffic line at that point is not thoughtful planning. We are in the very corner of Durham County where the area is quite rural. Since Chapel Hill was not able to build their re their bypass several years ago, Frington Mill has become the back roads bypass serving several areas like Pittsburgh Kerry and Apex. When questioned about the 850 units being built between Highway 54 and Barbie's Chapel, a developer answered

" And that illustrates the disconnect regarding ambient traffic because Fington Mill tease into Bab Chapel and any cars traveling east on that road will affect us. The Durham Planning Commission and your city council study each proposal individually, but all of these developments put together are creating a real strain on the roads in our area, not to mention the several other topics of concern. I hope you've driven out Fington Mill to see how unique this area is. Traffic is one of the many reasons we hope you will not approve the zoning or development of this area.

Everyone who uses Fington Mill will be affected by your decision. We do not think this is a good plan for Durham. >> Good evening, um, Mayor Williams and and

the council. My name is Jacqueline Jennings Lambertson and I graduated from Chapel Hill High in 1964, UNCC Business School in 1968. In 1974, I returned to this area to attend accounting classes at UNCC Business School. I rented a log cabin at the end of Fington Mill Road, which was the last mailbox on post office route one, box 106.

Jordan Lake, the Governor's Club, and four-lane Highway 15501 between Pittsburgh and Chapel Hill had not even been dreamt yet. There was no bridge connecting Durham County to Chattam County past my end of Frington Mill Road, only a dirt road which was used by hunters. I left the log cabin in 1979 and returned in 1999 to live in the downs on Kbec Drive for 10 years. Can in 2022, my husband and I moved into the retirement community adjacent to Fington Road in Chadam County called Carolina Meadows,

where over 700 senior citizens over 75 travel almost exclusively down Frington Mill Road to shop and seek other services such as doctor's visits andarmacies. Driving Frington Mill Road for over 40 years, I can attest that it has not greatly changed. The road may be a bit wider, but the path in the ditches look the same. The pressure on the road, however, has greatly increased as it has become the main artery for commuters from North Carolina 64 to I40 West and Durham. New construction on NC64 between Raleigh and Jordan Lake continues to place an increasing burden on this narrow country road. I call upon you to reject this zoning request on the grounds of maintaining reliable roads for the safety of the residents of the uh of all the common areas feeding uh the road and most especially

for the senior citizens at senior residents at Carolina Meadows. Thank you. Hello, I'm Eddie Williamson. Uh, my wife and I moved into Montclair in March of 24.

We came back to this area because of grandkids. I have coached college football for 40 years. I coached at Carolina and I coached at Duke. So, I've lived in Durham before.

We moved into Montlair. I have a grandson, my name'sake, that goes to Jordan High School and was playing on the junior varsity football team. It was important and the reason I moved back to Durham to see my grandkids. 3 miles to Jordan High School. I left

35 minutes before the game started. Now, they played at 6:00, so that put me on the road at 5:30. We got there in time to see the last two plays of the first quarter. I went stage coach road that trip.

The next trip, I went 54 to Jordan High School. I got there by the middle of the first quarter. So, I thought I'd made a little ground. But from then on for the home games, I would drive up Fington Road, try to get across at 54 and continue up Fington Road till I got to Old Chapel Hill, turn there, and came down Garrett Road from the north side just so I could see my grandson. You don't understand till you come out there and see just how congested traffic gets around those times of days.

I also in my retirement now officiate golf tournaments. And I have come from tournaments in Greensboro and Burlington and Alamance County. And when I get back to 54 coming down 40 west to east, I can't get on Fington Road to come home. I go down to Falcon Bridge and turn there to come home.

We're not supposed to live that way. And there's nowhere nowhere that you can build more roads because of the Army Corps of Engineers. I recruited Houston, Texas when I was in Texas at TCU. I never left the high school without getting a drink of water and going to the restroom because there's a lot of traffic down there. And I actually carried a cup for emergencies.

I am getting to the point I almost think I have to carry a cup here for emergencies. The only problem is that my wife travels to all those games to see our grandson and that won't work for her. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.

as he's uh getting prepared. [cough and clears throat] >> Sorry. >> Um Larry, you're Larry. Yep.

As Mr. Tedum is getting prepared. Final speakers, Scott Dickerson, Annette Rice, Kathy Rexro, Rexro, and Dana Young. >> My name is Larry Tatum. Uh my address is on file. I'm just going to talk briefly

about maybe 300 ft. That's the Little Creek Bridge. Little Creek Bridge was built in 1979 and it had to be rick wrapped in 2006. Uh the manufacturer of Rick Wrap recommends that the bridge be rick gets in inspected uh every six months.

I can't find any record where it's been inspected. Last record of inspection of this bridge was in 2023 uh where it was structurally poor, structurally deficient, meets the minimum tolerable limits to be left in place unre unremitted. The banks uh of the bridge are beginning to slump to the side. river control devices and embar uh embankment

protection is widely widespread minor damage. There are minor stream bed movements that have not been accounted for. The uh NC do is uh was originally going to replace this bridge in 2025. They pushed it back now to 2030.

uh any construction vehicles that are coming across this bridge, we are frequently waiting for traffic to pass because we have tractor trailers coming down what ostensibly is a small community bridge. Uh the pictures that you're seeing are the underlying infrastructure and as you can see by these two pictures how the ground and the bridge itself are degrading. Uh the red lines around the the road surface here. These are topographical and as you can see the closer lines are

showing how steep the banks are. There's no place to widen this bridge. And this is the underside of the bridge. As you can see, it's separating.

At the east end of the bridge, there has developed a dip that has progressively gotten deeper. Uh, anybody who goes across it will tell you they get the bounce as they leave the bridge and hit the road surface. um for this as added to the other traffic issues. I encourage you to vote no for this project. Thank you.

Good evening, uh, Mayor Williams, city council members. My name is Scott Dickerson. I live, uh, off of Keley Road, very near this site. Uh, due to, uh, explosive growth of the over the past several years, Durham needs water.

1 million gallons of water each day and now relies on the town of Kerry to fill that gap. To provide water for the current and future development, the Western Intake Partnership, Whip, will tap into the Jordan Lake water supply. Durham is the lead partner in this program in this project and a key part is the construction of a raw raw water transmission line from Jordan Lake up to Highway 751 for treatment and distribution. Almost half of the 16 12 mile transmission line will run along the

already congested and dangerous roads in the Brettmore area. This pipeline will run directly along the frontage of the the Britmore site. The construction of this force main will affect our already heavy traffic for roughly four years. Keep in mind our roads are the bypass between 15501 and Chapel in Chattam County and I40 in Durham and they are also the shortest route between Kerry and Chapel Hill.

While Britmore may be in a f future growth area, this area will now bear a four-year burden in order to deliver water for both the current and future growth in Durham. We ask you not to add to our gra growing pains. Thank you.

Good evening, Mayor Williams, Mayor Proam Cavayo, and other esteemed council members. My name is Annette Rice, and my address is obviously on file. I'm here tonight to once again remind you that the Britmore site is in a future growth area. But I'm sure that all of the things that my colleagues have shared with you tonight show you that this area isn't quite ripe for development of this sort.

There are necessary infrastructure projects that are going to affect this area for the next 10 years. You can see the blue arrow pointing down to just how small this future growth area is within Durham County. There's a timeline here of the approved infrastructure projects versus the proposed developments. If you look here, you'll see that the proposed Britmore neighborhood build begins in roughly 2026. They're already surveying out there

goes from 2026 to 2030. The water intake partnership line, the western intake partnership raw water main construction is going to affect these roads from 19 from 27 until 31. Remember nearly half of the length of that raw water main conduit is going to affect us. It's going to really affect our area.

When Larry spoke to you about the Little Creek Bridge replacement, that is going to take three years from start to finish. We're looking at definitely 29 to 31. An additional project that nobody has mentioned yet is the stage coach sewer main relocation. I'll show you that a little bit on the next slide. But this is something that is actually going to take the stage coach sewer main, move it further out of this Army Corps of Engineers property, and that way it'll better serve the areas

where future growth will happen and growth already is happening. Additionally, we have the proposed Morgan Farm neighborhood build, which you'll hear later on this year. Not shown on this chart is the highway 54 widening project that's currently listed on the 2026 to 2035 STIP. So we don't firmly have it scheduled, but it's three separate phases will all route additional traffic onto our area roads.

We are the default bypass. So from roughly 29 to 30, we are going to be in a world of hurt even without any additional growth. Take a look at this map and you can see that I'm not an artist, but hey, it at least conveys what I'm trying to say. Each of these projects is going to affect us. Please don't allow this to happen to us. Thank you.

Good evening, Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Cavio, and council members. Thank you for your patience and your attention to listening to us. I know it's really late. Um, and we wouldn't be here still if we didn't feel really strongly about it.

So, we do appreciate you. Um, I also wanted to commend Durham County for the work it took to create the comprehensive plan. That was a lot of community involvement. That was um a lot of collaboration and I just want to take a minute to read from the section on the guiding value of accountability.

There are three guiding values in there. One of them is accountability as you know but it says to be truly committed to an equitable community we must be accountable to our community with a clear purpose toward equitable outcomes. We must intentionally involve and empower residents in the planning and development processes and invite and encourage developers to work with us toward our community goals and objectives. We must invest our resources in ways that will achieve the values our community members say are important, like equity, accessibility, and resident well-being.

5 acres will contribute to attaining the type of housing community Durham County says it values. Will there be opportunities for equity and accessibility in a place where there are no sidewalks or bike paths outside the neighborhood? 4 four miles away with Jordan High School at 121% capacity. Is the development even within a safe 10-minute walk of a park?

No to all of these things. Is the developer working with the community to create spaces where residents can age in place? It's helpful that the developers agreed at the last planning commission meeting to include first floor bedrooms and a full bath and 10% of the single family homes built. But what about the remaining 90% of family single family homes in all of the town homes? Will any of the affordable units have a single accessibility feature? And finally, does Durham County value

its employees being able to live in the county? The developers offering 5% of units affordable to those making 80% of the area mean income. The AMI is currently 85K. 80% is $68,000 a year.

A teacher with a bachelor's degree in Durham public schools won't reach this base salary until they've worked in in the school for 26 years. Please consider voting against this development proposal. It does not meet the values that you have decided are important to Durham County. Thank you.

Hi, good evening. I think I'm the last speaker. Uh, my name is Dana Young. My address is on file, but I live in the Downs right across from the proposed development.

And um, thank you for this opportunity to speak to you tonight. I wanted to touch on the idea briefly that this development benefits Durham by adding 115 housing units over the past few years. And you can see from these graphs how um we'll get to this in a second. Over the past few years, housing supply in our region has surged.

Yet high prices make ownership out of reach for many Durham residents. New construction has largely targeted the high end of the market. The real unmet need is affordable and workforce, in particular housing. Workforce housing is homes for teachers, healthcare workers, and service employees. These households earn too much to qualify for subsidies, but far too little to afford today's market prices. According to the Durham Housing Dashboard, by 2035, and this is where these graphs come in, 44% of

Durham's new jobs will be moderate and low wage positions. Four of Durham's top five occupations fall squarely into this income range. As housing prices have risen, Durham's workforce has become increasingly costburdened, locked out of home ownership, or forced to live outside the county and commute in. An estimated 72% of people who work in Durham County cannot cannot live in Durham County.

And I'd also like to point out that the commuting pushing them out creates more of the commuting problems that were you've heard a lot about. Um, Britmore's price points are $775,000 for a single family home and 475,000 for town homes. This does not address the gap in housing supply that we need to fill. My final slide summarizes the broader issues with this proposal. This area is

already under significant stress from surrounding projects and development. making careful, thoughtful, and transparent planning absolutely critical. Yet, you're being asked to approve a textual development plan that provides no detailed site plan, no clear building types or placement, and no mapping of site conditions. That is not careful, thoughtful, or transparent planning in my opinion.

While this may be a future growth area, it should not be high density growth. This council has previously acknowledged that growth in lower density areas like this one requires careful consideration. There is tremendous value in [clears throat] what exists here today. The open space, forest, wildlife, and habitats already serve our community and Durham as a whole. Future planning should respect that value, remain consistent with community character, and address infrastructure and other concerns. We respectfully ask that you keep zoning rural residential and deferred development until a future growth plan

can determine what will best serve all stakeholders. >> Thank you. >> Those are all those are all of the speakers that I have. Um and we are going to take a break.

We take breaks every two hours because we have closed captioning. So um we're going to take a 10 an 11 minute break. m. I came to the city of Durham to improve

living conditions for [music] residents and I stayed because I'm encouraged to advance my career. The city of Durham, where careers [music] meet community. gov/careers. [music] >> [music] [music] >> Torto Durham NC diagonal careers. >> [music]

>> All right, let's settle up. Settle down. All right, we've heard all of our speakers, all of our speakers that have signed up for tonight. Um, back to the applicant.

>> Thank you, Mayor Williams, Mayor Prom Cabierro, members of council. Very briefly, would like to just address a few points. Um, first thing I want to be sure that we're >> Do you mind just making sure that Mike is directed toward you? >> Thank you, sir.

Um, first thing I want to be clear about, our access for Britmore on Frington Mill Road will not be opposite Kley Drive. It is going to be further south and this was again worked on with NC DOT and the city of Durham. Uh, it will not be opposite Kley Road. It will be further south so that it is a safer traffic movement. And of course, there'll be turn lanes built uh for access in and out of Montlair, I'm

sorry, in and out of Britmore and in order to keep construction traffic away from Montlair and promote safe ingress and egress, but the access point will not be opposite Kley Road. Um I wanted to share I hope you can see this slide here. the the traffic issues uh obviously are a major concern and it's important to recognize that the traffic count on Fington Mill Road is actually below where it was uh pre- pandemic. 313 dwelling units per acre which is the density we're asking for requesting with Britmore is quote high density as many people said, "I think that flies in the

face of the place type map that was adopted after we had a two-year community engagement process. " And that's how the Downs is designated on our future place type map. The Bitmore site is designated mixed residential neighborhood. 313 units per acre to implement what our place type map calls for.

And so, we had a robust community engagement uh, process to adopt the comprehensive plan and the future place type map. I do not recall these arguments being made to the county commissioners or the city council at that time for the Britmore site. Um, it's important to recognize that Fington Road is the delineation between the critical area, one mile from the uh elevation of Jordan Lake, the

pool, the normal pool level of Jordan Lake to um Fington Mill Road is approximately a mile. I bring that up because the city of Durham and Durham County have the strictest watershed ordinance in the triangle. If we were in Wake County, Chadam County, or Cha or Chapel Hill, Raleigh, Kerry, it would be a half mile critical area. But we in and I supported that back in 1995.

County commissioners like Ellen Reau and Maryan Black voted for it. The development community supported it. We've never asked for that critical area to be reduced. And so the designation of the future place type map respects the input of everybody in Durham that participated in that.

And we designated this site that we're discussing tonight as mixed residential neighborhood. It is clearly different from the downs which is designated rural and agriculture preserve. We also did a stream a jurisdictional stream determination on the 27 acres of Britmore that was turned in with our

initial zoning application um about six or eight months ago. There are no jurisdictional buffers on this site. So the slide you saw showing numerous buffers is simply incorrect. uh the farm pond that's on on site that's >> is simply what >> I'm sorry >> is simply what >> incorrect there are no jurisdictional buffers on this 27 acre site and again that was information provided to the planning department six or eight months ago um also want to emphasize that the farm pond that was referred to that's simply an irrigation man-made irrigation pond it has no jurisdictional um classification it is not connected to any to any waterway to a water, you know, stream uh that would connect it to any other body of water.

Therefore, it's a man-made pond. It's entitled to be uh removed. We would like to also address um the workforce housing

issue. Um that's obviously one of the toughest issues we face as a as a community. And I'm I recall um a statement made by former President Joe Biden at a speech he gave in Las Vegas. " And I believe President Biden was correct.

And so what we're looking at today is 37 estate homes on this on this 27 acres with with no buffers, no one no uh none of the sustainability um commitments, none of the affordability commitments. There'd be 37 estate homes that probably would sell for well into seven figures. Instead, Trioint has done the right thing, followed our place type map, put

forward a development plan that hits the mark on 23 out of 27 applicable policies, and um uh we would welcome uh the opportunity to answer your questions and perhaps explore other commitments to even improve upon that strong degree of compliance. Um so, we welcome your questions. We appreciate your time tonight and we respectfully ask for your approval. Thank you.

>> Thank you. Right. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

Um, thank you. Complicated case here. >> Yes, sir. >> As they all are.

So, I've got a couple questions and then so um the first thing is the planning commission mode is down 63. I just want to understand seems like there have been I just want to make sure clear. >> I'm glad you asked that. Uh in addition to um we we clarified that um accessibility would

be uh an important um feature of my of of Britmore. Uh and so we amplified the uh discussion we had with the planning commission to not only to have ground floor bedrooms but also have ground floor kitchens. Uh so therefore it can be age and mobility accessible uh for 10% of the units. Um we also uh we've researched it.

We can meet the 100-year storm uh detention on site. Uh RSCM uh can meet the 100year storm water uh treat the 100-year storm. And so um we wanted to also put forward if if um it's it's clear that this is a special site. We we appreciate that. Uh we can also go on the record tonight saying that uh we will exceed the tree safe. Uh that was of the three

or four policies that we didn't meet. One of them was exceeding tree safe. uh and so we can do that by having 20% tree coverage and and then another 1% of tree replacement. So we will go above and beyond what the ordinance requires in terms of tree coverage for this uh for this neighborhood.

Obviously that's an important that's an important characteristic of Durham that we have a great tree canopy and we will want to expand that. So we'd like to make that text commitment on the put that text commitment on the record as well. So thank you for that. We talked affordably which is >> as you as as you've noted >> council member >> let's um see if you're um can >> they're working on it.

>> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Is it >> maybe if you can use council member cooks. >> Sorry about that. So um so we talked a lot about affordability and as as you said and clearly if we do nothing here there could be 37 homes on septic which is not a great it's not what we want for the future of Durham, right? Um but there are concerns about price point and

sort of affordability. So we care a lot about affordability here. Have you considered more affordability? The 5% offer is I I understand that.

Is it something you would consider? >> What we what we would pref what we can [snorts] put on the record as an additional text commitment is prior to um any uh certificate of occupancy being issued for Britmore. Yeah. we can make a contribution of 150,000 to the Durham affordable housing fund that would provide gap financing for quite a few multif family units with a tax credit deal.

>> Appreciate that. I'm also you know as folks noted um Jordan High School is over capacity right now. So that so the I wonder if you have considered that that the issue the schooling capacity issues is also one. So is that something you would consider that as well?

>> Yeah, I I'm glad you brought that up. I reviewed the numbers today. Um, typically, you know, that's standard $500 per student for capital. Um, we can increase that to 25,000 um, prior to a

certificate of occupancy. >> Appreciate that. I also have a question for staff on this one. Um, because there there were questions about um, this being in the future growth area.

The folks from water management said um that if this were if the hookup were to be made, there's capacity there, so they would remove it from the future growth area. So, can you tell me more about like how we like what are the what are the metrics for for property being included inside the future growth area? Is it what are the beyond like water? What other metrics are we looking at to to make that determination?

>> Um, so I know that this specific site was in the future growth area because of sewer capacity. Um I'm not sure exactly what the the metrics are, what the um mechanisms are for the thresholds um other than the site was found that it is serviceable and there is um enough power in the area to serve the site. >> I wonder I wonder if the planning director Mike sounds like she I guess part of my question is when we look at when we determine whether um land is in the future growth area, are we looking at roads as well?

Uh good evening Sariam planning and development director. That was not one of the things that we looked at uh because there are roads throughout the entire jurisdiction. If we had looked at that uh a lot of areas would have been future growth areas. So future growth areas and typically once a development trips a certain threshold they're required to make transportation improvements.

So the things that were looked at during the comprehensive plan to establish future growth areas were predominantly water and sewer infrastructure availability. Thank you. And then also another question if you would I don't know if that's Miss Burgess this question but we heard we heard a number of sort of a lot of conversation about traffic right whether that whether we're sort of level of service F that we're approaching um or not. So so can you say more about how do we understand the sort of traffic concerns there?

That's the um yeah how do we understand those different perspectives there? >> Erelene Thomas planning and development department. So the capacity that's

provided in the staff report is a level of service D capacity. um that is the city's established threshold um you know even when we're doing a traffic study for when we would require mitigation um going beyond a level of service D and you and can can you confirm whether whether other developments that are in the area that are being planned are that also like to what extent are those are those sort of incorporated in in any kind of traffic analysis? >> So they are incorporated when traffic um studies are required. So all of the adjacent developments are captured and the effects of the the cumulative impacts are then accounted for.

When the TIA's traffic studies are not required, that level of analysis is not is not done as we cannot require mitigation other than turn lanes at the site access points. >> So the so the traffic counts we have there are based on existing that's sort of existing traffic. It's there's no modeling for sort of given other developments in the area. what that the

sort of models what that would look like is we're just doing this case by case. >> That that is correct at this level without a traffic study. Um now the uh Triangle West transportation planning organization is the regional authority for long range planning and they do maintain a travel demand model that does incorporate land use projections um to look at where future infrastructure improvements are needed. So, it's done at that level, high level of long range planning as well, but at the zoning level, on a case-byase basis, it's only done when a traffic study is required.

>> And also, there was um one of the residents made a comment that the Fington Mill Road is one of the five most dangerous roads in the in the area. I'm on the TPO. We look at this all the time. I'm not familiar with that road being one of the top five.

Can you confirm, yes or no, is that one of the top five most dangerous roads? >> I cannot. um we would need to, you know, reach out

to D to see what types of traffic um crash analysis or crash reports that they've been having. But usually those um high levels of crashes lead to projects, whether they're spot safety safety projects or other um safety initiated projects along a corridor. I'm not um aware of any projects programmed for this roadway. >> Yeah, Mr.

Man, I don't know if anyone from Transportation is on the line. >> Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

>> I don't believe so. >> Um >> Yeah. Um yeah, this is this is a this is a complicated case. Um as as you said, we we've got a conference plan that we approved as a community, right?

And this is on the place map. It shows mixed residential neighborhood. Um, at the same time, um, yeah, we we I get that we're at a sort of we're getting close to and adjacent to sensitive natural areas, right? So, that's a the tricky thing. You've limited improv to 50%. I

appreciate the commitment of storm water to the 100red-year storm. Um, um, but and yet the Army Corps of Engineers is not going to let us do a lot of work on roads. It's tricky with Army Corps. So, um, I'm still thinking about this one, but I appreciate it.

Thanks, stay over here. Um, I just want to say broadly thank you. I know it's a late night. Appreciate all y'all coming out.

So many people had slides. Obviously, a lot of preparation. Saw that a lot of you spoke at the planning commission. I just want to appreciate the engagement um and the hard work that's gone into this.

Um, did you say that y'all did submit a stream determination with the zoning request? >> I believe so, Rob. About that time. Yes. >> Okay. We have I just got sent an email that's from staff that says that there was not one sent with the zoning

request. So, I'm confused about that. Maybe this email is from Payton. So, I don't know.

She wants to come up. >> [snorts] >> We have done a stream determination. I apologize. I thought it was ter, >> but we've done a stream determination.

There are no jurisdictional buffers on this site. >> I'm sorry, what? >> We we have done a stream determination. There are no jurisdictional buffers on this site.

It may be that we were planning to turn this in if we get to the site plan phase. >> Who had the map with the stream buffers? Could you come up and and just address that really quickly? [snorts] >> Mr.

Saunders read >> Barry Saunders. Yeah. I was surprised to hear that a stream determination had been performed because although there are lots of survey markers down along

these little stream beds, um uh there was none submitted in the documents I reviewed uh at the time of the planning commission's discussion of this. um is until a steam determination is submitted. It's my understanding that the [clears throat] jurisdictional authority is the uh latest soil map. It's an old survey soil map, but um that's what I referred to.

>> Thank you. Could we get a staff response to that? I I'll also comment that streams in this area move from above ground to below ground. When you walk that property, there's a lot of collapsed um land that indicates subsurface flow.

So, what might have been a stream in 1976 for soil scientists may have gone below ground. Um but that pond definitely flows into uh Little Creek um above or below ground there. There is a stream

connecting that to Little Creek. >> Thank you. >> Hey, there has not been a official stream determination submitted with this resoning request. It was noted in the first round of review by storm water um just as an advisory comment that that would be something that would be required at the site plan stage.

>> And so what are the standards if there has not been one submitted? >> It's not something that's required on a textual development plan. It's something that's required of the site plan. >> Okay.

Yeah. I feel like on this issue and many others that we run into problems because we're looking at a textual development plan for a massive plot of land. Um which just limits us on what we can see. Um okay, a couple of other things.

Um Mr. Mr. Ber, a couple questions for you on the units that are have a first floor

bedroom, bathroom, and now kitchen. Um, are they uh accessible without stairs from the ground level? >> We haven't done the grading. >> We haven't done a grading plan yet, but we'll certainly be attentive to that when we get to the site plan phase.

That's actually a heavy um very important component of creating the site plan. It's it's a significant undertaking to to assess all the grades on site, but we'll certainly be sensitive to it and do everything we can uh to provide um accurate entrances for the accessible units. >> Can we get a commitment on that >> for those 10%. Unfortunately, we don't know at this time as the uh as many folks have alluded to the topography on this site. Um so, we're certainly going to do everything we can to make um um units

accessible without steps, but at this point in time, it's just not possible to answer the question. it. I mean, that limits the the ADA piece of that, right, which is just something to be thinking about. Um, >> there was some conversation at planning commission about having some overlap between the first floor units with the bedroom, the bathroom, and now the kitchen.

Um, and the affordable units. Did y'all come up with any options there or >> Yeah, I don't think we could commit the affordable units to having that configuration because it will be a higher cost of construction. So, it'll be a blend. We'll have affordable units and we'll have accessible units and that spreads the diversity within Britmore to a wider >> Okay.

>> population, >> but you can't be both disabled and poor. So, okay. Um Okay. So, uh, the study that you cited

had some issues stated that really what we needed were households that fall between 80 and 150% AMI. So, are y'all willing to cap the remainder of your units at 150% AMI? >> No, I can't commit to that. We cannot commit to that tonight.

>> Can you commit any additional units at 150% AMI? We our commitment on the affordability uh profer strictly the affordability profer has to remain at um 5% at 80% AMI for 30 years. >> Okay. I don't have any further questions at this time.

Thank you. >> Thank you colleagues. All right, I guess. Okay, go ahead. I wanted to ask about the

questions around placement in the ENO New Hope conservation area, concerns around kind of wildlife corridors and um you know it's not an adopted plan that we have in place. Um but it is one that the has been developed right has been researched. Uh and how should we think about that in regards to this site? Um, I know that the planning commission had pushed for that >> buffer on the western edge.

Um, but yeah, how should we think about that sensitivity of this of this land? >> I think that's a great question. My understanding is that this is actually an unranked wildlife quarter. Is that correct?

>> The corridor itself is is unranked in the study that we're we're referring to. Um, but putting that to the side, we recognize that this is an important consideration. And so when we looked at the future place type map, which designated not just the 27 acres of Britmore for mixed residential neighborhood, it also designated um an

area the parcels immediately to our west as mixed residential neighborhood and then the parcels to the southwest that are adjacent as mixed use neighborhood. meaning there would be incorporation of commercial or office or other uses within that. Given what the future place type map said, we thought it was important to preserve 50 feet on the western boundary of Britmore so that if when and if the development adjacent to us that's also designated mixed residential neighborhood um requests a resoning, it would have the opportunity and I hope the the mindfulness to include 50 feet on that assemblage. Therefore, there'd be a 100 feet corridor uh going north south through that this part of this part of Durham to the um to the west of Montlair. Um of course, the part of the reason why it's probably unranked is because Fington Mill Road creates, you know, a barrier at this area. But I

think in terms of doing everything we can that's feasible, I think that we did a good job and I want to salute planning commissioner uh Ramsey Richie for pushing that issue uh discussing it with us and and we made this text commitment in response to his concerns and the concerns that were that were raised by by others on this specific issue. Uh I I think that's the way to go. Um, but keep in mind you have to look at the the place type map and see what what it's not like the area next to Britmore is designated as uh rural agricultural preserve like the Downs is. It's designated for mixed residential neighborhood.

So, I think we're setting it up for success and hopefully we'll have a good neighbor to the west. I mean, when I look at the maps uh for Eno New Hope Conservation, you know, there's still it's still listed this area as important for for connectivity. >> Uh I understand there may be a ranking system. I don't think I've I've seen that. I mean, in disclosure, uh in a

prior role as an environmental grant maker, I actually provided the funding for the county's habitat connectivity plan, which is sort of the basis for some of this assessment now we're seeing for this and other other projects. And so, you know, when I see the role it has in that connectivity, it gives me some concerns from an ecological standpoint also with the neighboring heritage sites, um, you know, is something to consider. Um, you know, I also have to reflect on the fact that if it's developed by right, it's no guarantee that it'll be better and it may be worse environmentally. If we have 35 homes with fences, that will, you know, be worse from a wildlife standpoint, environmental standpoint, and it's hard to predict, >> you know, what will come uh as the result.

Uh, and so I'm, you know, mindful of that, of that tension. Um, you're also mindful of when I looked at the map that was shared about the stream buffers, it looked like a stream running through the Montlair neighborhood. And I'm not sure if, you know, that would have prevented the Montlair neighborhood from being developed in the first place if we had kind of held it to the same standard as being reflected for this other site, but this other site is the

one that's before us uh today. Um but yeah, as my uh colleagues have said, I mean there's a uh this is this is a tough one. We've made a lot of really strong commitments across a range of areas that reflect priorities in the plan but have environmental concerns and also you know the the the Army Corps question is a really tough one u because we've seen in other cases like you know Sheffield farms a couple years ago were that it really is a limiting factor to be able to uh manage for the future growth we're going to see that doesn't exist in other parts of the county. So, uh, I'm still sitting with this one, but thank you very much, uh, for once again all the folks who have been here, shown up for, uh, your community and advocating, you know, to the applicant as well, uh, for the additional profits you've made, uh, which, uh, which are strong.

Um, and I'm going to have to ruminate on this one to the end. Thank you. >> Yeah. Thank you. Thank you to all who are still here. It's 11:43 in the the

evening, so we're getting close to tomorrow. Um, thank you to uh the development team and uh for considering some of the uh and trying to address some of the concerns posed by by my colleagues. Um we are a growing city and we experience growing pains. Um, but we can manage that growth and that is one of the powers that we have at the city council and at the local government level even in the state of North Carolina in the southern United States.

We have the power to manage and shape the way that we grow and change. And we can do that and we can use those tools in a way that shapes a sustainable, walkable, green and inclusive city. Or we can use it in a way or not use it in a way that results in a city that is sprawling that is growing for the automobile and automobile dependency. Um and since 2017

we have done the latter. We have annexed and grown in the most unsustainable way by 7,188 acres. half the area of Manhattan uh has been annexed into the city and grown not in a way that is inclusive, that is connected, that is green, that uses the the 3Ds of walkability, density, diversity and design, but instead using culde-sacs, using wide roads, curve linear streets, single uses uh as far as the eye can see with long distances to drive to get to the daily needs that people who live in these places need to need to get to. Uh I cannot in good conscience approve any more of this kind of sprawl and this kind of development that will hinder future generations.

This will be the print our handprint that we leave on this precious earth. We have that power. That is one of the few

powers that we have at the local level. We need to use it and we need to consider how precious it is. Uh that is not to say no growth anytime anywhere. We've already approved uh growth uh this evening.

We've approved growth in past council meetings. It is to say that we need to be incredibly careful and thoughtful uh when these kinds of cases come before us. Um would is nothing acceptable in this location. To me, I would say things are acceptable in this this in this location, but they need to reach a high bar because of how sensitive this area is.

Uh because it is on the outskirts of our city, because it requires annexation into uh city and municipal uh limits. The bar is a is higher. We have considered uh we've spent a lot less time on much larger cases with a lot less consideration that

has happened this but this is not a minuscule site either. It is large enough where things can happen where conservation can happen where clustering can happen where mixes of uses can happen. Uh but that is not uh the proposal that is before us this evening. So to me uh I don't need to spend time this on this case uh in particular rearranging the deck chairs of I can stay at a high level.

This does not come close to the bar that I think that we need to reach and I think that it's time that we raise the bar not just for this case but for all cases moving forward. Thank you. >> All right. Good evening almost morning.

Thank you all so much for your patience and your advocacy as um I've read your emails and I've listened, but I also had the opportunity to connect with the applicant last Friday, Thursday. They all run together. Um I have not been persuaded to vote in affirmative for this case. I too have um suffered from

some of the traffic wos particularly at 54 and 40 and having to go like an extra mile to get in my apartment because I cannot cuz the traffic is always blocking the corridor. Also, I've been in this area most of my life, so I do know to take the back road to Chattam County and how to utilize that. So, I'm seriously concerned about the growth and development in this area. Um, the affordable housing component.

You can't just place affordable housing in community without any amenities around it. Um, and if we want to have diversity in that and you think about ADA accessibility, um, and making sure people can actually we have the diverse people can actually live in these um, homes and communities. So without access to transit and thinking about the impacts to wildlife and just the natural um the nature and then also the horses. So thank you for the pictures.

Um appreciate it. I just cannot in good faith move forward. I am of the operation that we get one earth is one thing that don't make any more of this land and we must be good stewards of it and how we move forward and I would be deeply concerned this will kind of um end up the same way what our neighbors are facing out in a different quarter of Durham where you have two lane roads are not really equipped for large

subdivisions this moment and if we're going to continue I know people can build by right but I would hope that at some point the infrastructure catches up and as this area is growing and more developments are coming online I do see that this going to be a major impact for you in your quality of life and So, I want to make sure you can get to your grandson's football games. And if you ever consider going back and coaching at UNCC, we I will welcome that as well. Um, so I'm just trying to have a little light-hearted joke cuz I'm so tired. But again, I cannot stand affirmative for this.

It has not been enough to persuade me to actually inconvenience our neighbors. Well, if you're coming from Chattam County or wherever you from, we are still have to be good neighbors to each other and protect our environment as well. So, >> thank you. I appreciate um it is a long evening.

Um a few months ago we heard Sheffield um farms and that was a substantively larger development and it made a lot of sense. You know this one doesn't have a TIA because it didn't trigger a TIA because it wasn't big enough. Um and so in that moment it made

a lot of sense there the the limitations of the Army Corps of Engineers um is real right that that is why I think it's it's water and sewer and also what else is happening with the roads um I am still a maybe um I will say that that is the main reason it is not because of the traffic it is not because of the environmental concerns um the median home price in Chattam County is 600 over $600,000. It is $200,000 more than the median home price in Durham County. The area median income for our statistical area for a family for as of last year is $120,000. Sorry.

Yeah. $120,000. Partly because we pull from Chattam County and other quite frankly much wealthier areas than Durham. I don't make my decisions for wealthy pe people who use back roads to get to their very very wealthy communities. It's not

how I make my decisions. And if I'm actually thinking about environmental concerns and I'm actually thinking about traffic, me saying no tonight doesn't actually help either one of those concerns. It just pushes it into another community. And then on top of it, we don't actually capture the tax base which we need to continue to increase our workers wages.

We're trying to get to $25 an hour this year. So it is just pushing the sprawl out. I find it fascinating that we went through a two, three plus year comprehensive plan process that several of us voted on affirmatively because either we were a planning commissioner and planning commission had to vote for it or a city council member and it passed. When a application comes before us and it hits most of the policies that are applicable to the case, it is comp plan aligned.

This this development, this density was envisioned for this area. Maybe not today because we're we understand the limitations with um with future growth area and other things, but I don't think it's to our benefit to not be really transparent. One of you mentioned equity and most of you and somebody else talked about their privilege. It's really hard for me to turn down housing.

Somebody talked about their their grandson at Jordan. We make I'm I make decisions because I need my kids to be able to afford housing in the future. I need my your grandson to be able to afford housing in the future. you're my kids are going to be thinking about buying homes hopefully soon, but not if their houses are $615,000 a year. That is unacceptable. And so if I vote no, the only reason I will be voting no is because I do actually have legitimate concerns around the Army Corps of Engineer Limitations.

But I want the residents who showed up, and I understand, and I say this often, change is hard. how communities look and what we feel and what we experience and how we perceive for the residents who've been there for 50 years. I I understand it's real different when I go back to Charlotte to the neighborhood. I don't go very often because no none of my family lives there anymore.

I don't recognize it. You can drop me down in Charlotte, you can spin me around and I I can't get around there. I lived there for a decade. I went to high school there.

I graduated there. We were forcefully annexed back then. the city just took your land and put you in the city and you were stuck paying city taxes. There was no decision around you want to be annexed or not.

So, um I am I worry about the Army Corps of Engineers. I do worry about those roads. When Sheffield Farm came up, I did not drive this site because I had driven for Sheffield Farm all over those roads and and saw the limitations and understood with the bridges and and and those things why growth could be constrained

until we can get that problem solved. But I do want our residents to really reflect when you say when we say no to something, it doesn't mean that something doesn't happen. I will say that 37 single family homes on septic does not improve anything and it certainly doesn't improve affordability. Um, so that's where I'm at.

Again, leaning no purely because of the Army Corps of Engineer issue and and really not because of anything else because this is comp planned aligned and it did envision more density and more um uh different type of housing product. Any other [clears throat] any other comments? Yeah, go ahead. >> Thank you. Um, and thanks everyone for hearing us out and I know it's late. Um, I just want to say that when we're looking at future growth, I

mean, it does feel alarming to me that we sort of look at future growth on a on a single issue basis, like that the sewer was ready and we didn't really think about the road expansion and capacity. Um, and those things feel really important to me. And um and I feel like it's just one of these examples of us not sort of like having a or needing a maybe more holistic plan and a more detail oriented plan, not just sometime in the future, but like actually looking at all the projects and understanding where in the future that growth needs to come and what needs to happen before and during that growth. And this is something that we do have the power to do.

We have the power to be more careful and thoughtful, as one of our speakers said, in how we grow. Um, this feels like pretty moderate density, urban sprawl, um, interrupting a wildlife corridor, without access to resources, not good infrastructure, overcrowded schools. I mean, the school

percentages are very high. Jordan, we say that we don't want to subsidize market rate housing, but that's more or less what we're doing when we're giving these huge booness of zoning map changes to get an influx of unaffordable market rate units. It's not meeting what we need. The study that was shown has inflated numbers.

They include commuters in there. They include people who are living in substandard homes in there. all saying that these people need more homes, like we need to build homes to meet the need as opposed to fixing up substandard homes or just understanding that commuters might not live in Durham and might work here. Um, that's only one of a few ways that they inflate the numbers.

The study inflates the numbers in multiple ways and there's like multiple paragraphs about it. But we're using this to sort of convince ourselves that we need any housing. Any housing is good housing, but we're sacrificing the environment for that. We're sacrificing

our residents quality of life for that. And that's not what we need. We don't just need more housing. We need housing for the specifically tailored for 80% to 150% AMI folks.

That is the biggest gap that we have. And we're not seeing that with this. And when we talk about the environment, we're not just talking about I mean, I love animals. I'm an animal lover, but I honestly like I wasn't really the environmental guy previously.

But we're talking about long-term sustainability. This is how the city will survive moving forward. So, it's safety, it's infrastructure, it's longevity, it's what we want to see, what we want to become. So, I'm going to go with the planning commission on this.

I'm not going to support this. I hope to see more plans that are not textual in nature for large projects. Um, and I look forward to seeing growth that is meeting more of the needs that we have as a community now and in the future. >> All right. Um, I do you want to respond?

Yes, sir. Go ahead. >> Just to address uh appreciate the comments that the council made and that's been helpful to our team. Um, just wanted to state on the record that based on comments by Council Member Cook and and some of the previous comments.

Um, we appreciate the the affordability issue. I I think all of us care about it deeply and certainly Tim Cyers, Ed Llamas, our team has done an awful lot to build affordable housing in Durham over the years. Uh but one thing we can address on the record is related to the environmental issues that council member Cook just um referred to and we can commit tonight that every house will be an Energy Star rated house uh within Britmore. And so we appreciate the points on traffic that council member Cababiierro um stated, but if we're setting up these homes so that people would have access to solar panels, EV charging, and an

Energy Star home, it certainly improves the carbon footprint of this relative to the vast majority of housing in Durham that was built 10, 20, 30 years ago. So I appreciate those comments. Wanted to respond to them quickly. Um, and I appreciate the lateness of the hour, so I was [clears throat] taking up more of your time, but uh, those are great points.

We appreciate that. >> Thank you. All right. Uh, just before we move on, because there have been a lot of profers, I want to make sure that I, um, got them all from you, Patrick.

Um, so that started with adding a kitchen as a part of the first floor living commitment. Um, upping to 21% tree coverage. >> Yes. 1% tree replacement, 20% Yeah.

with additional 1% of tree place tree replacement, sorry. >> A one-time donation of 150,000 to the Durham dedicated housing fund. >> Correct. >> Upping the uh Durham public schools to

25,000. >> Correct. >> And then just now every house in Britmore will be Energy Star rated. >> That's correct.

>> Okay. Thank you. Thank you. I just wanted to verify that was everything.

>> All right. Um I um how was your community engagement uh with this? I I see that you know we have a lot of folks from the downs. There are folks from >> um the the neighborhood starts with an M.

I can't remember the name of it. Montlair. >> Montlair. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Um I thought it was um fairly robust. We had three counting counting the outreach uh our property owner, Mr. Columbus did. We had three virtual meetings and then our team spent an afternoon on site a a uh based on one of those virtual meetings a property owner

reached out to us for concerns uh about and he he he on the south side of Montlair directly adjacent to one uh he was concerned about the slope issues, drainage issues and so our team spent golly maybe a whole afternoon with that gentleman. So, we had an on in-person meeting uh that I thought was very um constructive because it it gave us an example of what all the houses that are, you know, along the south side of Montlair, just north of Britmore, what their conditions actually are on the ground. And so, our team, Mandy, uh Tim, myself, um one or two other engineers, uh we spent the better part of one afternoon with that family. um and they didn't attend here tonight.

They said they didn't have any problems with it after we spent that time with them. So, we were ready, willing, and able to have those types of in-depth conversations with anybody in Bitmore. I thought they were productive. So, I think that that

was uh uh significantly above what the UDO requires. >> Okay. And did we talk price point on these? >> Pardon me, sir.

>> Did we talk price point? roundabout ball figures. >> Yeah, I I think the price points for the single family will be pretty much in line with what is the price point in Montlair for single family deal [snorts] >> town houses will be about 400 mayor. >> Okay.

What? Well, what's the what's the average home cost around there? >> Six or seven in Montlair. >> Sorry, Montlair is up around 800.

I didn't realize it was that high driving through it. >> And the downs, >> the average home value on the downs is well into seven figures. Mayor, >> I would guess it's

>> okay. >> I can please, please. >> Well, I can show you the slide. It's I mean the the issue is that you have regardless of how many there may be that are less than a million dollars.

4 million house to drastically pull up the average. So that gives you an example of what types of homes are are available in the downs u at the current at the present time. [snorts] >> Three cent. So that that and again that's just if you look at it on Zillow that's what would come up.

>> Okay. Uh please do not do not do that. Please okay. [clears throat] Um so I I used to drive this area a lot. I used to live in this in this this area. Um, [clears throat] and there you're right there there are certain parts of the day where uh Frington is is a

headache. Um, but I I think that you know we are we we are we are experiencing the pains of a growing city and um we we're we're going to we're going to feel these these these pain points a lot. um when it comes to traffic, when it comes to change, when it comes to quality of life, and you've been living somewhere for a really long time. Um I think what I struggle with is when we include, you know, equity and affordability in some of these conversations.

Um when it's, you know, we we get really theoretical about it. And I don't know, this could be contributed to how I grew up. Uh for me, life is very black and white. You know, I I think about who has a roof over their head and then who doesn't and I think about those issues and I think about then the next layer the complexities [snorts] around

environment you know and and you know and then next le layer quality of life and you know environmental and all those things um I'm interested in the the just the I see the application I see the comments what and I I wish you like you guys are no offense you're you're legal, you're a developer, you know, like the person or people who own this land, what was their vision, you know, and sometimes I wish I could just hear from them and and just think about that. Um >> Oh, you're already the owner. >> Yeah, actually we know we know that. >> Oh, you want to talk about >> what was what Yeah.

What's >> Oh, sure. >> What was your vision for this? >> Oh, my name's Ed. >> So, you own this?

>> Yeah. My name's Edward Llamas. I'm the managing member of eight. >> So these are your neighbors?

>> No, these these are my neighbors. I >> Okay. What What was your vision? >> No.

Stop talking. Excuse me. >> Just just here. >> I can't hear. >> Say that again. >> What What was your vision for the site?

But >> before before you respond, let guys it is late. But even though it's late, I still want us to be respectful. So, please stop yelling for us or or speaking loud from the audience. Please don't, you know, do this and and I don't want us to be offensive at each other.

It's a very tense thing. All right. We even get tense up here sometimes. I still feel tense, but let's be respectful, please.

>> Okay. The >> the vision for the site was driven by the comprehensive plan and it was identified as this is mixed residential neighborhood. has always been in the urban growth boundary and it's never been considered to remove from the urban growth boundary. It has sewer, it has water, and it has no critical areas.

It's like bang bang bang. It was absolutely everything. And and then I went through and met with staff and said, you know, what what what do you

need here? And they said, "Well, because it's a site that's mixed residential neighborhood and it's over five acres, you need two housing. " And we kind of just worked through the process, but it was all comprehensive plan driven. All comprehensive plan driven.

" And that that's kind of how we've got there. And I I think before we started tonight, was it 23 out of 27? I mean, based on the text commitments now, is that 25 out of 27 in terms of being compliant with Is that right, Patrick? >> Okay, that So, thank you. Um, we we don't we always hear from the applicant representative, and I I appreciate that. And where I'm going with this is there's one of my colleagues made a point about, you know,

text amendments and, you know, looking at things on a case- by case matter. Um, I'd be curious if you know all of your other neighbors who own land around you. And and I I just I don't know how that works. And I think we I I'm not even asking for a response on this one.

I think we're going to have to figure that out because I don't know how practical that really is, but it is something that we run into a lot. You know, we're expected. I mean, and I think that's the purpose of the comprehensive plan to tell us what we want to see where, you know, what goes there. But then we and we put all these rules in place and we talk about the size of annexation.

you know, uh, Council Member Baker referenced Manhattan, but in a practical sense, you know, we also have annexing and the size of Manhattan and put housing on that as well. So, there are two sides to it, but the fact of the matter is I I this stuff is really complex, you know, and I don't want to pretend that that doesn't exist. Uh, but I don't

know how we with the UDO and the comprehensive plan and all the other things that we've put in place. I I don't know what more we do and and and putting everyone together as if they know each other or like all developers are in the same building and we are going to say, you know, now build the city the way we expected and we have all of these documents at the same time. So, I don't know how that looks right now, but I know that's the ex that's the desire, you know, and so and I I'm glad you were here tonight and I wanted to hear your vision because you said exactly what I was hoping you say, which you looked at the comprehensive plan, you know, and at some point I don't I we have the UDO, we have the we're rewriting it, but we have the comprehensive plan and it's still not enough, you know, and I I'm just really I I again, this could be from lived experiences of my own, But, you know, I I know that there are a lot of folks like myself who are who are trying to get a home and I know we have to consider things like the environment.

Uh, but I I know also that, you know, we run into our we run into a situation sometimes where it is it is a privilege to to be concerned about, you know, some things that others don't, you know. So, I just wanted to put the whole picture out of what I consider and the things that I actually uh, you know, think through. So, I I want to I want to say to the residents who came tonight, I appreciate your concern and you have a right to those concerns and I don't discount those concerns. I appreciate your vision.

You have a you have a right to that and I appreciate that as well. So, um I feel like I'm on the fence about all this, but colleagues, I'm just going to um think quietly about it and and and I'm going to take my vote as well. Uh I'm probably leaning uh I don't know 5149 for this, but we'll see. Uh, [clears throat] all right. So, it all Oh, actually,

did I close the public hearing? >> Yes, >> I did. I did. I did, actually.

>> Residents, did I close the public hearing? >> I did. I did. All right.

Well, in case I didn't, I officially closed the public hearing. Declared the public hearing closed. I think I did, though. All right.

And now, um, I'll I'll entertain a motion to adopt an ordinance annexing Brent Moore into the city of Durham and to authorize the city manager to enter into into a utility extension agreement with Trioint Homes Holdings Incorporated. >> So moved. >> Second. It's moved and properly seconded.

All right. Please close the vote. I apologize. I think my mic died. Um, the motion fails uh 6 to one with uh

Mayor Williams voting yes. >> All right. Thank you so much. All right, colleagues.

I believe that is it for tonight. Uh, good morning everyone and we'll see you all in the uh I don't want to see you all in a while. [laughter] Have a good night. Thank you all so much for coming out. Thank you.